Strategy: What does a professional trainer look at?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by dpw417, Aug 22, 2008.


  1. dpw417

    dpw417 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    What are some aspects of developing a winning strategy for your fighter?
    What do you think a professional trainer looks at? Tendencies, strengthes, weaknesses, etc...Those are general comments...
    Angelo Dundee commented that before the Hagler/Leonard fight, that he felt confident because he had noticed that Hagler always stepped forward with the right foot before punching, he told Leonard to move away, or hit him before he takes the step..."Watch the step!!!"
    (Saw a recent article on Nacho Berestien and Roger Bloodworth talking about their fighters Joel Casamayor and Juan Manual Marquez...It made me think of this thread)
     
  2. The Wanderer

    The Wanderer Boxing Addict Full Member

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    In terms of scouting opponents: always take a look at the footwork, it seems to often one of the biggest clues to a fighter's intentions , and if they're creatures of habit, (which most fighters are) how they're moving can give away when a punch is coming, what kind, and a lot of other things. And it can open up small, seemingly unnoticeable vulnerabilities.

    For example, in addition to the story you mentioned about Hagler, I remember reading Eddie Futch saying that one of the keys to Norton giving Ali such a hard time lay in Ali's footowrk. Ali always took an unconscious step back after throwing the jab, so Norton would block and counter with his own jab, which would make have to respond with another jab, and take another step back. A couple of times like that and Ali would be running into the ropes. And Teddy Atlas had a similar story about the first Holyfield-Moorer fight. Holyfield tended to bounce on his feet, so he was briefly vulnerable while doing so. Part of the gmeplan was to jab Evander when he started bouncing, because it would always leave a short opening.

    Really though, as a trainer scouting an opponent, you're looking at everything, trying to break down everything about a fighter's style, psychology and his unconscious physical tendencies. Look at how the fighter holds their body. Is it different when they're just looking to circle and/or jab to when they're going for a big shot? How do they respond to pressure? What are their greatest strengths and weaknesses, and how do they respond to various styles? How do they respond if forced to fight outside their usual comfort zone? How does their physical makeup compare with your guy's? etc.

    At least, that's how I imagine it would all go.
     
  3. natonic

    natonic Boxing Addict Full Member

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    This is good stuff. I read this and immediatly thought of Tito Trinidad. His footwork is very deliberate and it seems a little slow. he tries to plant that front foot before firing. This started to catch up with him when he started fighting really good boxers.
     
  4. Bill1234

    Bill1234 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    They look for the other fighters rythms and how they react to certain things. They also look at the footwork and try to see how they move for their certain intentions. They will look for the different techniques and how they set up certain combos aswell.
     
  5. Vantage_West

    Vantage_West ヒップホップ·プロデューサー Full Member

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    hopkins camp were responsible for seeing that trinidad looked for counters...it may not seem right but he liked to get on the inbetween shots. they needed a bait to get trinidad to hook. to which he was susceptible to leave an opening.

    left uppercut was the punch of choice as you could cover up wtih your right hand then send a rigth hand down the pipe.
    form the start of the fight you see hopkins throw this baited shot over and over again and i think in the 5th round or so when trinidad is starting to lose. he started to hook more to which hopkins landed more right hands...coincidence:think



    also i heard that eddie futch noticed ali was incredibly open and leaned back when he threw an uppercut with either hand and only used it when his man was close in range and weaving. so he used joes naturally talented left hand to great use to get him to hook when ali leaned back becuase there was no way he coudl get out the way of it.

    everyone remembers the knockdown in the FOTC. but the roudn before ali was seriously hurt with the same manuva.


    even the not so high elite classes can still pull off tricks. super-middlewieght journeyman darnell boone made a post on esb on how he out smarted lajuan simon. whenever lajuan came in he dropped his right hand. so when lajuan jabbed himself in darnell got himself backed up to the ropes, as usual simon threw the right hand to which darnell blocked .simon put his right hand next to his bollock to which boone slipped by him and span him aroudn so he had his man in a corner and let it rip.

    a bad decision. it wasnt even gonna be televised but most of us saw it.

    good fight


    this is what i love about boxing you can see the finer things above just punching and blocking
     
  6. Bigcat

    Bigcat Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    When sizeing up opponents i tend to look at what he does the most of... Is he repetetive in any way... What flaws does he have that are subtle, and how do you counter them without making it look obvious.. A fighters own worse enemy is his lack of versatility.. If he does similar things in a similar order he becomes as easy to read as a childrens book.. Look for the fundamental basic mistakes (common) first.. When throwing the jab does he drag the right hand down away from his face .. (Exposing himself for the text book left hook. ) Balance .. Is the opponents balance that great.. watch his feet in video in accordance to his punch output.. does his feet move correctly along with his feet? Does he over reach.? Does he have a tendancy to circle in a certain motion favorably (clockwise or counter clockwise..) in each case try to force him to move against his favored motion.. anything you see that you can try to control , and make it less comfortable for him.

    Hope some of these are helpful or at least insightful.
     
  7. dpw417

    dpw417 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Good post.
     
  8. dpw417

    dpw417 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Tito is deliberate, it seems moreso at middleweight. I remember Bowie Fisher kept telling Hopkins," Keep using the jab, he doesn't like the jab...it's like drops of rain...drops of rain." He knew the jab kept Tito back and having to reset to fire that hook. Hopkins also stated he watched Tito's feet as a cue to what Trinidad would try.
    Thanks for the post.
     
  9. dpw417

    dpw417 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    BC, this is insightful and helpful. Top notch post.
    In regards to being repetitve, some truly world class guys are with certain combinations...BUT attempting to capitalize on that is something else again...because of the speed and/or power.
     


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