Sugar Ray Leonard vs. Floyd Mayweather Jr.

While I'd never compare him to Collins I don't think Mayweather has fought anyone of real note at 147, not when we are talking about matching him against an ATG at the weight.

Mayweather may have "hidden gears" at 147 but he could have done with them against Oscar (at 154) and we didn't see them. The whole arguement of his hidden talents that we havn't seen yet, him turning it on "when he feels like it" is reaching. Its using Mayweathers poor level of opposition at 147 (when compared with the greats) and his failure to be really impressive against that poor opposition as a reason to say "well there MUST be more in the tank"....

He's 31, you've seen what there is to see and its nothing that special at 147 when we are comparing him with Leoanard, Napoles, Robinson, Gavilan and the other greats at that weight.

 

I'd agree he hasn't fought anyone of real note at 147 (although still better than the competition Collins fought in his career but let's forget that). I don't think that was Mosley's best weight and you'd have to assume he was well past his prime despite the Margarito victory, which was surrounded by all sorts of intangibles.

I'm not saying that there MUST be more in the tank, just that I believe there is. Again against DLH we saw Mayweather's unusual boxing attitude come out. Do just enough to win. He could have come out swinging when Oscar opened up late on, as many of the ATGs would have done, but as usual he took the safety first approach in the belief that he was doing enough to win anyway.

I'd like to see him beaten and then go into a re-match to see what he brought to the table and I'd like to bet it would be a much improved performance.

 

Gaz, you've hit the nail on the head. I always year Floyds fans say 'if he needs to, he can'.

Well, he hasn't, and if he doesn't, he isn't 'great' IMO. Pacs legacy is safe, Floyd needs Manny to cement his reputation.

 

you're saying Floyd comp at 147 is better than Collins?

Didn't Collins fight Mike McCallum? Not only a better fighter than Floyd has fought but better than Floyd himself.

EDIT: And Kalambay. In fact, I think a lot of pro-Floyd fighters would be a little less 'up' on him were they aware with Kalambay.

Would I rate Collins higher than Floy? Absolutely not, despite his opposition Floyd has shown skills, and has at least performed well in (most) of his fights against 'Elite' opposition. Collins, whilst facing 'greats', did not perform sufficiently well for me to consider him an ATG, and I personally think Prime Benn/Eubank would've dealt with him emphatically.

 

I was on about George Collins Flea, just being sarky about boxer having unlimited potential if they keep beating average opposition and looking average doing it.

And people wonder why unbeaten records are so prized. Come and join me in my "Joe Calzagle vs. Michael Spinks" thread....;O)

 

I thought he had Marquez, De La Hoya and Mosley all on a string by the end of their fights (more so Mosley). That's impressive; even taking into consideration the stage at which these fighters were in their career. He didn't push on and close the show, and that's always been a frustration with him, but I think the business man side of him comes out in such situations and he's happy for the fight to go the distance.

He needs to fight Pacquiao though, because he's in his prime and he's proved he is a legitimate welterweight. If he can beat him comprehensively then his other fights against supposedly faded legends will be looked at in a different light i.e - he made them look older than they really were.

 

TBH Bona I don't think any one those fights, while decent performances, were that impressive. All 3 fighters were past their primes and another had the extra problem of being too small. Theres nothing in those 3 fight IMHO that give any reason to believe that Mayweather is up there with the greats at 147.

Talking of the Mosely fight, if a prime Leonard had of had Mayweather in the same trouble that the 38 year old, natural Lightweight Mosely did in the 2nd then I don't see Floyd making the end of the round.

 

**** me!!!

I hadn't read any of RichT's and Gaz's back and forth :rofl

Just saw Collins and assumed someone had chucked Steve Collins names into the mix.

I take it all back, but the point still stands. Floyds skillset is not that special. Coupled with his opposition, I think he gets a free pass. And for what? It's just 'cool' to like Floud for some people IMO, although I get some very balanced views from a lot of posters on EsB so not saying everyone who rates Floyd is off ther head, just to clarify :good

Some just take it too far, and I think it's down to ignorance.

 

Also, I wouldn't fancy Joes chances with the likes of Parlv, Marvin Johnson and Yaqui Lopez (he could potentially win any or all of those 3 mind, would have to pull it out of his arse to do it though :yep) let alone Spinks, Qawi, Galindez, Mustafa, Saad and Conteh who all looked (and proved) they were a class above.

I'd pick nearly all of them to stop him.

 

Hell of a generation of Light Heavies. The best ever IMHO.

 

Leonard to stop him in round 10.

 

Its not impressive when you compare what Leonard would have done to each of these men. Marquez would be extremely lucky to make it past the second round and DLH and Mosley wouldn't see the final bell either IMO.

 

That's a very good point actually. This thread has officially worked.

 

Was a bit confused when I saw the ref. to McCallam.

I haven't once said that Floyd is 'great'. At least I don't think I have :huh. He hasn't faced the opposition to warrant being included in the top 10, 25 . . .whatever.

What I'm saying is that he has risen to the required standard in every challenge he has faced to date and in my opinion could be capable of rasing the bar again faced with tougher opposition (although also note that I haven't said that I think he'd beat SRL as some in this thread have). This is far less ignorant than giving matter of fact statements about a theoretical match up. :good

Not interested in the Pac V Mayweather debate.

 

If it was 6/5 pick'em with the bookies who would your money be on Rich?