Sugar Ray Robinson vs Willie Pep (Vid)

I'd also like to see the street fight between Robinson and Billy Graham that happened in Harlem. Maybe Raging Bull has that as well. :huh

 

I know he has Filo Bedo vs Tank Murdock

 

Lucky for Robinson he had all that weight on Pep in there amatuer match

 

Thanks

 

Arguably the 2 best p4p fighters in history.

 

Except they fought at the same weight :smooch

 

So did Valuev & Holyfield, doesnt mean one didnt have an unfair size advantage naturally.

 

Well did you know Robinson weighed 116lbs in 1938, the same year he faced Pep? So Robinson was only 17 when they faced each other. He competed as a featherweight and went 85-0 in the amateurs before starting his career as a lightweight. Pep just isnt as great as Robinson anyway and anyone putting him up there is trying to re-write history

BTW Holyfield won :yep

 

Yep, I heard Holy was robbed, shame really, he wont retire until he wins the HWT title, you`d think those assholes would show a bit of compassion for once in their sorry lives & let the man retire in peace, especially if he deserved the nod.

On Robbo/Pep.... even Robinson would tell you the main reason he beat Willie was his huge height, reach & power advantages.... both guys were the best ever in their best weight class (WWT & FWT) & utterly dominant in their primes, only losing to men a weight class above (Lamotta & Angott) who were both MWT & LWTs.

To me, Ray was the most complete fighter in history, he had everything but I regard Pep as the greatest `boxer`, a defensive genius, a boxing poet.

I dont like to compare both, I like both & rank both guys in my top 3 boxers ever tho I do have Robinson at no1 because he was dangerous in every way possible.

:thumbsup

 

Fair play mate, I think Pep is an amazing talent but not quite up there with the Robinson's in term of completeness. His resume is comparitively thin too.

People assume SRR is a natural WW, but only politics stopped Robinson being a LW champion. HE beat Angott at a 1 1/2lb over the LW limit so Angott wouldnt have to give up his LW titles when he lost. Zab Judah actually wanted to fight Floyd Mayweather at 148lbs instead of 147 so he wouldnt have to give up his belts too and thats why he faced Baldomir instead of Floyd

On your Lamotta-Angott loss comparison for SRR and Pep, Robinson was giving up about 17lbs, Pep only about 4lbs. Robinson was only just fighting above LW at that time.

Can't see Holy ever retiring sadly, which would be ok if he stepped down a level or 2 but he wont. Cant believe they ripped him off

 

what makes robinson so invinsible? pep certainly was right at robinsons elite talent level. he put on a winng streak to start his career just as good as robinsons

 

Robinson said in his book he outweighed Willie Pep. unless u provide me a source otherwise, i wont believe it

completeness? Pep dominated an entire featherweight diviison for a whole decade and beat almost every single Ring Magazine top 10 contender out there in a highly talented featherweight era.

who did robinson beat that was as good as prime sandy saddler? hall of famers manuel ortiz, chalky wright, top lightweights Willie Joyce Allie Stolz and Paddy Demarco, top dangerous featherweight contenders Sal Bartolo, Phil Terranova, Humberto Sierra, joey archibald, Miguel Acevedo, Jock Leslie, Eddie Compo.

While it does not have the longevity robinson's does, it certainly was not a thin resume and ranks up there.

 

How about competition, its far far better than Peps, dominating the best LWs/WWs (Burley aside) and then jumping upto MW and beating the best there

How about moving through weight classes, from 116lbs (amateur weight) all the way to 175lbs

How about the fact he is better on film, physically and athletically more capable. Ofcourse hes far better offensively than

How about the fact Pep lost to Angott while giving up 4lbs, while Robinson beat the 17lb heavier Lamotta

How about spectators and experts of the time rating Robinson as the best ever? They saw Armstrong/Pep/Moore/Charles all the rest and knew by watching Robinson was better

 

1. Robinson was weighing around 116lbs upto 126 then, Pep was a flyweight (112lbs)

2. Completeness as a fighter, Robinson was far better offensively, far faster, rangier and a more natural fighter. Pep just wasn't as special. Not to say he isn't special its just Robinson was something else.

3. How about Angott Then there's the little matter of Galivan, Lamotta, Henry Armstrong, you know fighters that are actually regarded as great other than top 10 contenders. Pep's FW era just wasn't that deep and there weren't great fighters he beat Saddler aside.

4. Ofcourse it isn't thin as a resume, but by ATGs top10 standards it is a bit of a thin resume.