Teddy Atlas says Tyson isn’t close to being an All Time Great [2017]

In fact, Spinks might have been the most prestigious fight Mike fought in the 80s...I don't count grandpa Larry as prestigious.

 

I should probably point out to you that it was Don King who did everything he could including trying to strip Holyfield of his WBC titles for not facing Tyson immediately after beating Douglas. The only reason why Evander accepted the fight was because Tyson went around Dong King and accepted a smaller share of the purse in order for the fight to made.

Remember it was Holyfield who fought Foreman, then Holmes before even considering a Tyson fight. It was also Holyfield who ducked Ruddock leaving him for Lewis to choke on and took on the "softer touch" Bowe.

 

Bowe a softer touch than Ruddock? Not in my opinion. Ruddock on his best day wasn't even prime Norton level imo.

I could have misinterpreted what you wrote if so, I apologize.

 

I get what people are saying about the Ruddock fights but that is simply not enough. If tyson gets a pass for losing his legacy fights because of his brawls with Ruddock, then Liston gets a pass for his brawls with Williams.

 

Same old story w Teddy, a man I do happen to like a great deal .. I don't see ten heavyweights that defeat that meteor .. From Berbick to Wiliams he really was a force .. I also don't buy that he was a quitter .. he was unprepared against Douglas and took a terrific berating before he lost .. he also took a terrific beating from Holyfield without quitting ...

 

Biting his ear was quitting imo.

 

It’s may be hard for people who weren’t around at the time, given what a complete blowout the fight turned out to be but this was actually considered one of the biggest and most anticipated fights of the decade. Certainly the biggest heavyweight fight since Holmes v Cooney in 1982. It was bill as Super fight 88 by the press and all the many boxing magazines of the time and there were a lot of fans and respected boxing names that genuinely thought that the unbeaten Spinks could win. Certainly he was considered the only heavyweight that might have a chance.Personally I didn’t think Spinks hit hard enough or move well enough to beat the rampaging Tyson but there were many at the time who did.

It’s just a shame that critics in the years since the fight have undermined the performance of Tyson in that fight by dismissing it as being a mismatch and questioning the credibility and accomplishments of Spinks as a heavyweight fighter but at the time it was definitely seen as been a legacy matchup between the two best heavyweights in the world.

 

Atlas is a very bitter man, with a large chip on his shoulder. He is this way in general, but even moreso in all things related to Tyson. He is hardly an objective analyst when it comes to judging the accomplishments of Mike Tyson.

Now that he's in the IBHOF, I imagine he is getting increased opportunities to offer his "analysis." That hardly makes it objective.

 

I actually like to listen to atlas on certain subjects but when he says a single world about Tyson I switch off

 

When it happened all it was for me was one guy who dubiously beat a nearly-three-years-past his prime Larry and another guy who definitively beat a five-years-past-his-prime Larry.

I knew Spinks would lose to Mike, but was made more than certain of it when I saw his eyes before. Whatever chance Michael had (and it was admittedly slim to none regardless), I think the fear made him kind of quit beforehand. A big joke.

Too bad, but hey Spinks was an ATG light heavy imo, and it was still remarkable he came up all that way to win a belt.

 

At the time the Ruddock was considered the more dangerous fighter on account of the 19 rounds with Tyson. This is before Bowe actually fought Holyfield.

We now know that Bowe was the better fighter but it wasn't as apparent back then.

 

Your timeline is off a bit.

Yes, Holyfield did engage in the big money, low risk Foreman fight before agreeing to fight Tyson. But, after Mike re-established himself with two wins over the then highly rated Razor Ruddock, Holyfield, agreed to fight Tyson in fall '91.

The fight was highly anticipated and, in retrospect it is unfortunate it didn't happen.

Tyson pulled out and then Damiani was picked as a replacement. He pulled out and Bert Cooper stepped in.

Then, Tyson had the legal troubles and was out of the picture indefinitely.

It was only after he upset Ray Mercer in early 1992 that Holmes was considered as an opponent for Holyfield

I hope this clears it up for you.

 

1) The Holmes that Tyson beat, was better than the Tyson that Lewis beat. The one that Spinks beat was better than the Holyfield that Lewis beat.

2) The look on Spinks face before his first fight with Larry Holmes is identical to the look on his face before he fought Mike Tyson.

 

1) I'd say this is pretty accurate, though I know Larry hadn't fought in the better part of two years before he faced Mike (not sure what the Mike/LL situation was).

Surprised about 2!

 

Maybe but that was not in his prime years ..