Terence Crawford vs Kostya Tszyu

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by ForemanJab, Aug 19, 2017.


Crawford vs Tszyu

  1. Crawford

    45 vote(s)
    50.0%
  2. Tszyu

    45 vote(s)
    50.0%
  1. Radrook

    Radrook Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Bud vs The Real King Kong Ortiz!

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  2. Tettsuo

    Tettsuo Active Member Full Member

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    Tszyu has no advantage over Crawford. Crawford has the height and the reach advantage. Tsyzu also fought in a very Euro-centric style that would actually be a detriment for him against Crawford. Crawford is not chinny and isn't erratic like Judah, so even if caught, he'd be smart enough to not put himself in a bad spot. Tszyu's only plus is his "famed" timing that fans yammer on about like he can time God and score a KO.

    The plus for Crawford is... well, everything else.

    Crawford UD or even late KO. Honestly, I see it as easy work from Crawford.
     
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  3. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

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    OK we've done Oscar vs Crawford time for Tszyu vs him

    Amateur record

    Tszyu 259-11 (I've also seen it listed as 260-10)

    Crawford's 70-12

    So Crawford incurred more loses in 82 fights than Tszyu did in 270 even though he fought at a much lower level than Tszyu

    And obviously Tszyu's amateur accomplishments>>>Crawford's by a country mile

    Tszyu's opponent's win/loss ratio

    Tszyu 1064-130 loses

    Crawford 514-205

    Number of world champions fought

    Tszyu 15 (13-2)

    Crawford 4 (4-0)

    Number of world title fights

    Tszyu 18

    Crawford 10

    Number of times fought on the road

    Tszyu 15 including unifying twice in his opponent's country and winning his first world title in his opponent's country too. So he won all his world titles in his opponent's country and defended his titles many times on the road and in his opponent's country

    Crawford 1 for his first world title fight

    Obviously winning on the road or in your opponent's home country is more difficult for a number of different reasons and more impressive than beating them in your backyard/country where often everything is stacked in your favour and against them. Beating Zab Judah or Sharmba Mitchell in their country>>>beating them in Australia or Russia. Winning away>>winning at home.

    Crawford has fought outside of his country once, whereas Tszyu did it 15 times, 15 fights on the road out of 33 fights.

    Miguel Angel Gonzalez 43-1-3
    Zab Judah 27-0-0
    Sharmba Mitchell 47-2-0 & (55-3-0 for the rematch)
    Diosbelys Hurtado 28-1
    Jake Rodriguez 26-2-2
    Rafael Ruelas 52-3
    Oktay Urkal 28-0-0
    Julio Cesar Chavez 103-4-2
    Hector Lopez 26-2-1
    Hugo Pineda 27-0-1
    Jan Bergman 32-0-0
    Ben Tackie 24-2-0
    Jesse James Leija 43-5-2
    Angel Hernandez 40-1-2
    Roger Mayweather 54-11-0
    Pedro Sanchez 26-1-2
    Corey Johnson 20-1-1

    And in his 4th fight he fought Juan Laporte 37-11-1

    In his 6th Sammy Fuentes. Fuentes went on to pick up the WBO JWW strap later on in his career

    10th Livingstone Bramble

    Laporte, Bramble and Mayweather were past their best but they were still solid opponents for world class fighters.

    Beating Laporte in your 4th pro fight>>>>tomato can Aaron Anderson 0-0-0 now 3-48-0.

    Beating Sammy Fuentes in your 6th fight>>>can Travis Hartmen 9-10-1

    Beating Livingstone Bramble in your 10th fight>>>can Cory Summerville 1-3-0

    Beating Hector Lopez in your 11th fight>>>can Marty Robbins 23-45-1

    Tszyu was fighting some very solid guys from early on in his career, Crawford didn't even get in there with anyone with a pulse until he was 19-0

    Crawford

    Postol 28-0
    Diaz 19-1
    Indongo 22-0
    Beltran 29-6-1
    Gamboa 23-0
    Burns 36-2-1
    Dulorme 22-1
    Molina 29-6
    Klimov 16-0
    Lundy 26-5-1
    Jean 29-1
    Presscott 26-4
    Sanabria 34-1-1

    Shout out to @BoppaZoo as this post was inspired by an old one of his
     
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  4. Cobra33

    Cobra33 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Funny. Going into the KT fight Zab was unbeaten. Being talked about as pound for pound one of the best.
    KT destroyed him INSIDE 2 rounds with 1 punch.
    Zabs career never turned out to be what people thought after that but he could fight and he was quicker then Bud. Remember he gave !Mayweather problems early on.
    Bud is more of a complete boxer then Zab but KT had that power.
    Don't know who I would pick. It would be a great match regardless of the outcome.
     
  5. Sandman_

    Sandman_ The Phoenix flew & the Big Fish knew Full Member

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    No-one has addressed the elephant in the room - Tszyu's losses.

    Both came when he was underdone in terms of fights leading into the fateful days (or nights as the case may have been).

    As an obvious statement, both losses were extremely hard fought wars of attrition. Saying "Tszyu quit" in the Hatton fight ignores the fact his corner pulled him out after receiving a non-response to the question of was he okay to continue. He was obviously gone and should not have continued. It's debatable whether he even understood what he was being asked - but I digress.

    There were a number of issues that contributed to the Vince Phillips loss, the two most important being:

    1. Phillips, a decent fighter with good punching power, fought a great fight, and
    2. Tszyu's lack of competitive action leading into the fight meant he was underdone going in and ultimately not capable of withstanding such an unexpectedly strong challenge.

    The seeds for the Vince Phillips loss were sewn when Tszyu's management chose Leonardo Mas as an opponent in his previous fight instead of Charles Murray (a decent American who would have given Tszyu rounds). Mas was hopeless, couldn't stay upright and was stopped easily in the first. The ref ruled technical draw for a late punch which at the time, stained Tszyu's perfect record. Tszyu spent much of the lead-up to the Phillips fight upset about that as well as losing a court case to his former promoter. While they were distractions out of the ring I think the fact Tszyu didn't get any meaningful work against Mas (following on from a couple of one-sided fights in Australia the previous year) left him vulnerable in his next fight. Tszyu's management should have chosen Charles Murray who would not have taken a dive in the first round. They were offered both potential opponents & chose Mas presumably believing he was an easier fight for the same money. They were right about that but I reckon it cost them next fight.

    There were lots of other reasons given for the Vince Phillips loss but I think it was as simple as Phillips being fight hardened coming in (he lost a tough 10-rounder not long before) & Kostya Tszyu being underdone (as a consequence of opponent choices made by his own management).

    The moral of the story is it's a fine line in boxing & timing is everything.

    Tszyu had long stretches of inactivity leading into the Hatton fight & was underdone for that one as well. Probably shouldn't have been fighting at that weight at that time either. He looked like a corpse at the weigh-in. In saying that, he looked terrific against Sharmba Mitchell in his previous fight (despite also looking like a corpse at the weigh-in) but that one didn't last very long either.

    When you find yourself in a tough war of attrition, you need some tough hard rounds behind you in order to prevail at the back end of the fight.

    Tszyu didn't have them going into either the Vince Phillips or Ricky Hatton fights.
     
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2017
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  6. ForemanJab

    ForemanJab Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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  7. FastSmith7

    FastSmith7 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Tszyu knock out Crawford... almost as overrated as Wilder.
     
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  8. chitownfightfan

    chitownfightfan Loyal Member Full Member

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    So was did Gamboa.
     
  9. dougemerypm

    dougemerypm Active Member Full Member

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    Funny, Mikey Garcia found that "weak division" as did Linares and others AFTER Crawford left. Where were they when he was there? Perhaps he was the reason the "division was weak."
     
  10. NoNeck

    NoNeck Pugilist Specialist

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    Zoo also has an unavenged knockout loss to Vince Phillips and of those 15 “champions” he fought (two of whom won their belt by stopping Zoo), Zab and Hatton were the only two who were really shining when the fights took place. So Zoo quits half of the time when fighting a prime, above average champion according to that stat.

    Crawford’s level of performance since Postol is higher than Zoo ever achieved.
     
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  11. Sandman_

    Sandman_ The Phoenix flew & the Big Fish knew Full Member

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    Tszyu opens a can of whoop-ass on Bud "American Dud" Crawford's head.
     
  12. Braindamage

    Braindamage Baby Face Beast Full Member

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    What's does today's weak division have to do with Phillips whooping up on KT? The real question would be, how would Crawford have faired against the likes of Phillips and Hatton.
     
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