The best fighters you'd take Pacquiao over in any weight class?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Tin_Ribs, Oct 16, 2010.


  1. Tin_Ribs

    Tin_Ribs Me Full Member

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    The overriding consensus on here seems to be that while Manny is a great fighter who ranks highly in an overall sense, he's harder to appraise in a h2h sense, more often than not coming out on the losing end of hypothetical matchups. As an example, although valid arguments can be made that he has overtaken the likes of Chavez, Arguello and Harada, the people who would choose him to beat any of them at their respective bests are often in the minority. The mood seems to be that he was too crude and weight-drained to succeed consistently in the smaller weight classes, but that he might also struggle higher up despite his speed advantage and technical adjustments.

    So my question is this: who are the best fighters you could see him triumphing over at any weightclass he's ever campaigned in?

    I'm more interested in the general calibre of fighter than individual names so as to gain a vague sense of how you all rate him h2h.
     
  2. El Bujia

    El Bujia Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I might favor him over Howard Winstone at Featherweight. Interesting clash, that one.
     
  3. GPater11093

    GPater11093 Barry Full Member

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    Barrera at Featherweight.

    Over ten rounds I reckon he could beat Saldivar at Feather also.
     
  4. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    Armstrong, Pryor, Chavez and Saldivar. I think he could maybe beat Arguello & Ortiz, but those I'm undecided on. Pac is a nightmare for pressure fighters as a whole
     
  5. El Bujia

    El Bujia Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    It's an interesting one. On the one hand, any fighter who takes the fight to Saldivar might be going about things the wrong way, but Pacquiao had a lot of firepower at the weight. He's certainly capable of hurting Saldivar early. Still, I'd favor Saldivar to weather that storm, turn the tide and come crashing down on Pacquiao in the later rounds.

    Those nautical puns do anything for ya?
     
  6. El Bujia

    El Bujia Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I think quite the opposite, actually. Elite level pressure fighters, anyway.
     
  7. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    You think he gets smothered out of it?

    I do worry about that straight of his against anyone wading in. It's an absolutely elite punch.
     
  8. El Bujia

    El Bujia Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I've always been of the opinion that he was a momentum fighter, although he's been recently improving in that area (albeit against tailored opponents). Against an elite pressure fighter, I do think his speed/power would be thwarted to a considerable degree, stripping of him of perhaps his two most valuable assets. I don't necessarily believe he'd be run over by anyone around his best weight, but I could see quite a few beating him handily. Chavez is one I've little doubts would beat him.
     
  9. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    I agree on Chavez. I think that he may be a little more cultured than Armstrong though...put it this way, I like Pac's chances against Armstrong better than his chances against Chavez (which is weird, because I hold Armstrong in higher regard overall).

    I think to beat him, you have to neutralise that right hand in a specific way, I wouldn't like to see anyone relly upon their style to take it out...to an extent I agree with PP, because he has superb footwork now, and taken in tandem with an elite trailing punch, that is serious news for an action pressure-fighter. Thinking pressure is the way to take away that momentum IMO, by which I mean patience.
     
  10. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    I don't see any basis for this and its the style hes taken on and beaten the most at the highest level - MAB (although transitioning to boxer puncher), Cotto, Hatton, Diaz

    The pressure fighter typically has several disadvantages against the Pacster. For 1 they are typically not that quick so Pac's punches nearly always land first. Secondly if they rely on taking punches they are facing an A Class puncher, not only that their nature of coming forward will be impaired by taking the punches and push them on the backfoot. Then there's the fact are coming forward so he doesn't have to look for them and its hard to get out of the way of such fast hands at close range. They also often rely on outworking their opponent but are facing 1 of the best conditioned boxing athletes ever who can easily throw 100 punches a round
     
  11. Tin_Ribs

    Tin_Ribs Me Full Member

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    Pac's straight left is a good punch for catching swarmers out, but I think the likes of Armstrong and Chavez would have a really good chance of mullering him on the inside and against the ropes where he doesn't do enough for my liking at times.

    I like Winstone to edge him slightly, but Winstone's lack of a big punch might work against him. El Bujia has summed up my thoughts on Pacquiao and Saldivar.
     
  12. GPater11093

    GPater11093 Barry Full Member

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    Shivered my timbers.

    It's just those fast straight shots from Pac and his overall speed. I reckon he can sharp shoot straight down the middle and then get back away. After about 5 or 6 rounds Saldivar will start to come on but I reckon it would be too late.

    A 12 rounder I'd favour Vicente though. A ten rounder is much more open generally, though.
     
  13. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    How does he go with prime Oscar at 147?
     
  14. Tin_Ribs

    Tin_Ribs Me Full Member

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    Do you not reckon that Saldivar might up the ante a bit earlier if Pacquaio forced him to? We were on about this sort of thing on that old Jofre thread if you remember.
     
  15. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    An interesting 1, DLH didn't do that well against faster opponents or ones who could match his speed. But Oscar has size advantages and despite dominating Pac didn't look too comfortable punching up against a 5'11 man. I'd hesitantly lean towards Oscar