the best pav can do

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by dbouziane, Feb 22, 2009.


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  1. dbouziane

    dbouziane ............. Full Member

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    a lot of opinions about whether pav showed improvment and maturation or whether he let a man retire on his own that he should have disposed of on his terms. I've been watching him for a while and think that all that aside...pav is as good as he can get at the moment. even after taking an ass whipping from hopkins, he really didnt do much different last night..maybe a new wrinkle here and there. is that good enough to beat AA...maybe and maybe not. which then leads to two obvious questions/conclusions...

    (1) loew needs to go before he fights AA and AA pops out of his shell defense with that counter left out of nowhere and puts pav down or...

    (2) pav can't do anymore or any better...both he and loew know this and the two are just trying to do the best with the hand they are dealt.

    which do ya'll think????? :huh:huh:huh
     
    dbouziane, Feb 22, 2009
    dbouziane, Feb 22, 2009
    #1
  2. brando18b4h

    brando18b4h Active Member Full Member

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    I think Kelly needs to get a fresh pair of eyes on him an elite trainer Roach,Mayweather or how about Richardson ? I would stay away from Manny though.
     
    brando18b4h, Feb 22, 2009
    brando18b4h, Feb 22, 2009
    #2
  3. Borincano

    Borincano Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    A new trainer. I have not been on last night to see any Pavlik threads so my opinion of last nights fight; Rubio is a 154 fighter so I did not think it was going to the score cards regardless.
     
    Borincano, Feb 22, 2009
    Borincano, Feb 22, 2009
    #3
  4. senko

    senko New Member Full Member

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    He beat rubio into submission. I would say that was ending the fight on his terms.

    What "more" do you want him to do.

    The AA fight will be awesome and I cannnot wait for it!
     
    senko, Feb 22, 2009
    senko, Feb 22, 2009
    #4
  5. dbouziane

    dbouziane ............. Full Member

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    I'm a fan of pav...i just didnt see anything different than any of his previous fights. that being said...is where he is at and what he brings to the table enough to beat AA??
     
    dbouziane, Feb 22, 2009
    dbouziane, Feb 22, 2009
    #5
  6. Tom_Tocca

    Tom_Tocca The Provider Full Member

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    Tom_Tocca, Feb 22, 2009
    Tom_Tocca, Feb 22, 2009
    #6
  7. dbouziane

    dbouziane ............. Full Member

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    nope...didnt catch that one...does raise some good questions tho. i just think maybe pav is as good as he can get. i've been on the "loew's gotta go" team for a while but after last night, i'm not sure he can do anything different or change much outside of a new wrinkle here and there. to paraphrase dennis green after the cards bears game: HE IS WHO WE THOUGHT HE WAS!!!! i love pav and he's fun to watch but he is what he is and there's nothing wrong with that.
     
    dbouziane, Feb 22, 2009
    dbouziane, Feb 22, 2009
    #7
  8. Borincano

    Borincano Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I disagree. I believe he has more to give. There was talk of maybe Hopkins helping him, but like someone else mentioned, why not Richardson. He is very much still young and can be taught much more. He will need it if he fights AA.
     
    Borincano, Feb 22, 2009
    Borincano, Feb 22, 2009
    #8
  9. dbouziane

    dbouziane ............. Full Member

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    yeah it would be interesting to see what richardson/hopkins could do with him. pav's defense is his offense and if you can nullify it like hopkins then he's pretty much a sitting duck as hopkins showed. AA is different in that he doesnt give awkward angles and all that like hopkins does...he does let you do your thing until he sees an opening and then explodes. i remember the second miranda fight and AA didnt do much of anything except sit there the first few rounds waitin, almost studying behind that shell of his and then that counter left came out of nowhere and floored miranda.
     
    dbouziane, Feb 22, 2009
    dbouziane, Feb 22, 2009
    #9
  10. Borincano

    Borincano Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    That is not what I meant. Richardson will add to his arsenal. I did not mean for him to teach him to fight like Hopkins or his defence. Hopkins is Hopkins. AA can wait and study you, but the answer is to keep busy with the jab and combos in his face. You heard it; the best defence is a good offense. This guy could be the full package if he believes in himself and starts thinking of adding some help. I am not saying to get rid of his trainer, but add.
     
    Borincano, Feb 22, 2009
    Borincano, Feb 22, 2009
    #10
  11. El Cepillo

    El Cepillo Baddest Man on the Planet Full Member

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    There is no reason why Pavlik can't unify the middleweight division....well....apart from one....ARTHUR ABRAHAM!
     
    El Cepillo, Feb 22, 2009
    El Cepillo, Feb 22, 2009
    #11
  12. Borincano

    Borincano Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    It can be done with a great gameplan, but AA can derail him with those powerful shots. Fighting with a broken jaw; he is one tough champion.
     
    Borincano, Feb 22, 2009
    Borincano, Feb 22, 2009
    #12
  13. sean

    sean pale peice of pig`s ear Full Member

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    kelly can improve with age and experience.

    longevity is the key to a fighter improving, look at glen johnson.

    as he has gotton older he has become a better fighter.

    so did calzaghe , well at least he showed more strings to his bow.

    fighters like kelly will learn to pick off punches/read opponents better and be more adaptable to different styles.

    kelly is what he is though , and i do not want him to change much up, as he is an exciting fighter he goes for the ko and does not play it safe all the time.

    when you fight like this , it is natural you have to ship a few more ,
    although i think he will need experience because when he is in adversity he is not going to get great analytical advice from his corner and is going to have to learn from his own experience`s and sparring when faced with more tricky opponents, stylewise.
     
    sean, Feb 22, 2009
    sean, Feb 22, 2009
    #13
  14. dbouziane

    dbouziane ............. Full Member

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    i agree...but in watching pav throughout the years, i'm not sure his corner has ever had much of a "gameplan" for any fight. Loew always says "we noticed he (insert fighter) doesnt like to fight going backwards so we wanted to press the action." Well not too many people do like fighting going backwards. so when someone actually doesnt go backwards on pav, they had their way with him. (see aslo mosley's fight against margo). the problem with AA is that he doesnt mind backing up and waiting for an opening. so i'm not sure what loew will do b/c unlike hopkins, AA does exactly what pav's corner wants him to do but he's doing it b/c he wants to and not b/c he's being forced to.
     
    dbouziane, Feb 22, 2009
    dbouziane, Feb 22, 2009
    #14
  15. Borincano

    Borincano Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Johnson is a totally different kind of caliber fighter. I fully understand your point, but I don't think Pavlik falls under that. He really needs more help from his corner and I think think that the corner is limited not he. If he takes a few loses and beatings, he will get lost in the rankings and someone else will replace him as the top dog. Think about it, he got schooled by older Hopkins and many fans started second guessing his talent. He has to come out each and everytime with a strong win. Come out thinking and performing like Mosley just did.
     
    Borincano, Feb 22, 2009
    Borincano, Feb 22, 2009
    #15
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