The Duran of the Hagler & Barkley fights: how good a middleweight was he?

I'd favor him over pretty much any MW around today, Abraham and Pavlik included. Of the list you posted:

Emile Griffith- Would've been an interesting tactical affair. Griffith was obviously more accomplished at the weight, but not sure how favorably he'd have matched up against Duran. I'd probably favor him to win a decision though, as I think he'd have been a very difficult matchup for Duran at WW.

Jose Napoles- I think Duran was a better MW than Napoles, who just didn't mesh with the weight very well and was far too small for fill it out right. I still think it would've been a competitive affair though, as I do at any weight, moreso the lower the weight.

Carmen Basilio- Interesting. I've always thought Basilio would've been a hell of a matchup for Duran, I'll think on it.

Felix Trinidad- I'd take him to outbox Tito in this one rather than beat him up, but I do think he'd get the better of the in-work as well.

Mike McCallum- McCallum at MW would have to be favored IMO.

James Toney- Toney at his best may have won, but if Toney was having another one of those patented "off nights" I'd expect the Duran of the Hagler fight to outbox him due to Toney's lack of footwork.

Kelly Pavlik- I'd favor him over Pavlik, as Pavlik's lack of a strong boxing brain would see him getting countered often, and he wouldn't be able to out-muscle Duran in close or match up with the craftier man there.

Winky Wright- A matchup that Duran should win handily if he's at his best, but during one of those inconsistent spells around the mid to late 80's could get jabbed up and made to be ineffective.

 

Excellent thread, as usual from Dinamita.

Basilio/Duran would have been alot of fun. I would have loved seeing that. I'd give Duran, one of the greatest ever, a strong possibility of beating all the guys featured here. You pretty much have to. I do agree with Sweet Pea above on his specifc comments regarding Toney.

 

I think in any era, Duran is going to have some sort of success at Middleweight, but he'd always be inconsistant.

160 version of Duran on his best night, would be at the very least competitive with all the fighters you mentioned.

Napoles wasn't proven enough at 160 for me pick him over Duran. He showed that he was still a quality fighter in the early rounds against Monzon at 160, but nothing to suggest that he would beat Duran at the weight IMO.

He could outbox Trinidad or Pavlik, their power is always going to be a threat to Duran, both (especially Trinidad) are sharp enough punchers to land flush on top form Duran on occasion, Pavlik also has the benefit of being able to punch down against Duran, adding to the power of the shot. I think I would lean towards the Duran of the Hagler fight to beat Trinidad, and probably Pavlik as well although his size (big advantages in height and reach that could allow him to keep the fight on the outside) would make things interesting. In the end though, Duran on top form should be able to see the punches coming and counter Pavlik frequently and get on the inside where his shorter, sharper punches combined with his unmatched in-fighting craft would allow him to clearly get the better of Pavlik.

Winky could outwork him to a competitive UD. I think it would be an interesting tactical affair if both are at their best. I'd favor Toney, McCallum, and Griffith over him at 160.

Basilio would be interesting because he would force an inside fight with his style, and nobody was better than Duran on the inside, but given Basilio's superior size and strength, I'd probably take him to push Duran back and outhustle him for the decision.


As for how his performances against Hagler and Barkely add to his greatness, I think they're a big part.

What other Lightweight, a few years past his best, is going to last 15 rounds with Hagler, let alone be good enough to take about 5 rounds.

Winning the Middleweight title 17 years after the Lightweight title is also one of the most impressive feats in boxing history IMO.

 

I would love to have seen Duran vs Griffith. I think the ref would have to stop it by round 12 or 13 due to blood loss.

 

i just read his book "hands of stone" and i honestly think he would of beaten hagler and here is why:

1. he hurt his hand in round 4 in the fight but he never told his corner, but roberto in the book said it stinged when he hit with the power shots.

2. he was ahead on scorecards upto the 13th round (i think) according to the official cards. and duran and his corner admitted that he did lose a little steam and was a little tired and haglers supreme conditioning NOT boxing ability made him win the last 2 rounds and get the fight,

3. in the hagler fight he bust him up and he hardly had much damage, hagler admitted he got bruised worse in that fight then others even accusing duran of causing his eyes to swell due to a thumb in the eye!! (which i never saw)

4. duran defensive abilitys were the very underated ask all who faught him when he actually trained and took the fight seriously. his head movement, and anticipation and timing in the hagler fight was genius.

5. coming from weigh class lower, and mixing it with natural all time great middleweights just shows how good duran was. he kept his power and took every thing hagler etc dished out but bust up then more then him (i am not saying the hearns fight as he never trained more then 1/2 weeks for that fight and was seriously out of shape and prep for hearns)
which brings me to the point reason he went on and on, is that he never ever took really flush shots he was a genius defensively and his head movement was fantastic. very deceptive defensivly only got cut but never badly due to shots

6. durans boxing brain and genral smarts were very good indeed. just watch his tactics how he changes according to his opponents bring to the table.

his trainer and roberto admitted some losses he had were due to his money, fame, drink and believing his is too good and not training and conditioning himself. i seriously think no middleweight in their prime todaywould of beaten a prime roberto duran

 

well consider wat barkley did to hearns and wat duran did to barkley then you got your answer

and please fellas dont start with all that tommy got caught with a lucky shot talk

barkley through a punch with the intention to ko tommy and he did aint no luck there

 

Top form Duran will beat Griffith, Napoles, Basilio, Pavlik.

I believe he also overwhelms Trinidad in their fight, but Trinidad punches sharp enough to make it very interesting.

Wright at his best can give Duran fits if he is able to keep his range and effectively fight his fight, jabbing away. I would likely pick Wright in this contest.

My money is on McCallum and Toney as well, though (for reasons mentioned above) it is not beyond reason to see Toney losing either. Both at their best I would probably have Toney.

 

Are you including Hopkins? I would have a prime Hopkins as a clear favourite over Duran at Middleweight.

 

are youatschatsch serious?

dude roberto duran - yes roberto duran i suggest u study his fights and then post.
who at middleweight did hopkins fight (who were close/at their prime) other then roy jones who was a all time great as good as leanard and hagler ?

 

What are you proving in this post? Not sure if I'm missing the point. Hearns also stopped Duran cold in the second round of their fight, despite not having it at Middleweight.

 

Very. Both on their best nights you would have Duran as the favourite?

 

Great thread... Duran is one of the top 5 fighters of all time.. HE very well could be considered the GOAT and I think it would be consensus if he ended up beating Hagler, which he could have.

He is great at MW... I would agree with Sweet Pea on most of his conjectures ... I think Napoles would give him stylistic problems at 160 or 154...

That would have been something .... Napoles vs Duran , as long as Napoles doesn't get cut

 

who at middleweight did hopkins fight (who were close/at their prime) other then roy jones who was a all time great as good as leanard and hagler ?

jeez how old are u?