The Fix In The Jungle?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by BillB, Jul 20, 2012.

  1. MagnaNasakki

    MagnaNasakki Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    ...because he's going to lose, thereby depriving you of your money. Because I'm going to beat him. Because I think I'm going to win, I'm the cocky upstart.

    Do I really have to give you a ****-talking 101 course?
     
  2. Longhhorn71

    Longhhorn71 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Just reiterating what he actually stated in print........that is what really upsets those who fall victim to the Ali / Clay dupe-a-fication.
     
  3. MagnaNasakki

    MagnaNasakki Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Its ****-talking. You taking it as a confession of illicit compliance in a fight fixing scheme is lunacy.

    Every underdog who ever predicted a win is signaling a fix.
     
  4. Longhhorn71

    Longhhorn71 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    The Dundees were mob related choir boys....and then you throw in Don King trying to pick up the heavyweight bauble at a later date in Zaire.

    Plus you got Ali with an IQ that could not even pass the U.S. Army entrance exam targeted for a 4th grade education.

    A bad combination of characters to provide legitimacy to events.
     
  5. xRedx

    xRedx Boxing Addict Full Member

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    He's gotten lucky all throughout his career. Cus D'Amato says:

    "In Cassius Clay's first fights he had a lot of luck. He fought Sonny Banks, and he got knocked down. He fought Henry Cooper, and he went down. When he fought Doug Jones, he won by the skin of his teeth. When he fought Billy Daniels, Daniels was ahead on every card when all of a sudden a cut opened up over his right eye and they stopped the fight. In the first Liston fight, Clay wanted to quit."
    http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1079455/3/index.htm

    The gift decisions against Ken Norton, the loose ropes and general corruption of the Foreman fight. Getting lucky with Joe Frazier's cataracts in Manilla. The pro Ali judges in most of his post-thrilla in manilla fights. How fans argue Ali was shot when he fought Leon Spinks when it is evident he just wasn't training enough (rematch is the proof).

    Ali's whole career has been a miracle, I guess that's part of the legend too.
     
  6. BillB

    BillB Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Ali refused to go to a neutral corner for 17 seconds after the "knockdown".
    After finally being installed in the neutral corner, he left it and returned to the center of the ring before the fight was signaled to resume.

    Walcott could have disqualified him and should have.

    Instead, he awarded Ali a KO victory, that never happened. There was no KO. There was no count.


    Was it all a mistake? Was Walcott really that stupid?

    I think it is extremely naive and gullible to believe that he was.
     
  7. SolomonDeedes

    SolomonDeedes Active Member Full Member

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    D'Amato was talking Ali down because he was talking up his own fighter, Buster Mathis. In reality of course, there's nothing lucky about getting knocked down and then getting up and winning. There's nothing lucky about wanting to quit but deciding not to. And Ali was ahead on all cards against Billy Daniels.
     
  8. SP_Mauler

    SP_Mauler Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Walcott had nothing to do with the fix.
     
  9. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    It's a bit like in class when I make a mistake and a kid points it out and I say "I did it on purpose just to check you were paying attention" when you have a choice between an elaborate scheme or a simple mistake, the simple mistake is usually the right one.
     
  10. BillB

    BillB Well-Known Member Full Member

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    It wasn't a simple mistake and it would not have been an elaborate scheme.

    "Joe, here's $20,000. Help Clay every chance you get".

    That's it. Nothing more.


    That is much easier to believe than the notion that a man who fought 69 professional fights, scoring 32 KOs and being KOed 6 times himself, did not know what a knockout was.
     
  11. SP_Mauler

    SP_Mauler Boxing Addict Full Member

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    He continued the fight. If it wasn't for Nat Fleischer then the fight continues or was Fleischer in on it too?

    He let Liston lay there for how long and then continues the fight..think what you're saying lol
     
  12. Wass1985

    Wass1985 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Wasn't he the same guy who predicted that Mike Tyson was going to be the greatest heavyweight of all time?? :rofl
     
  13. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    So you think he helped clay by failing to start a count and allowing a fight to continue?

    Had what you said really occurred he'd have begun counting straight away and waved it off if and when liston beat the count.

    Walcott was a great boxer but he was far from a great referee.
     
  14. BillB

    BillB Well-Known Member Full Member

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    1. Fleischer's involvement in Walcott's call was an absurd excuse. Fleischer had nothing to do with the fight. He was a spectator. Walcott knew that.

    2. Liston lay there exactly as long as he should have- until Ali was in a neutral corner. He then immediately got up.
    Continuing the fight proved Walcott understood the neutral corner rule.

    Why then did he stop the fight five seconds later, and award Ali a KO?
     
  15. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    We all know why, nat told him he'd been down over 10 seconds and jersey mistakenly called it off.

    I'm sorry but your theory can easily be explained by way of a simple mistake. You want me to believe jersey took a bribe then I'm gonna want more proof.