I mean, I don't really grade on H2H for legacy positioning. If I did, the Ali and earlier era HWs would be vastly toward the back. Sports evolve, and they are frankly just too small. I grade on in era achievements and impact on their sport and society in general. And I don't see Ali and Louis ever being equaled there.
I see what you mean, 'society in general' is a bit off topic to me though. I agree you can only judge a fighter in his era but wider sociological impact is f all to do with boxing. Are we marking people down for not fighting in times of (legal) slavery? X fighter will never be as 'great' a boxer as Muhammed Ali because he's not oppressed? I don't buy it. Nobody is suggesting Jesse Owens would beat Usain Bolt over 100m, why do boxing hardcore have to give the Johnsons and Alis a greater ATG standing for their socio-political importance? This is boxing not a popularity contest.
Eh, to each their own. I rate Owens the beat sprinter of all time for just those reasons. Obviously he cant compare with Bolt "H2H". If H2H then the guy who comes out on top of this HW boxing era probably blows everyone else away in the same way Bolt does. For your other point, boxing is seen differently by many fans from sprinting because the records arent tangible. Even though the logic behind the advances are even more clear than in sprinting and other sports. I mean, sprinting doesnt have weight divisions. Boxing does, and the size of HWs has gone up dramatically. But since you cant compare performances in the same tangible way as sprinting and all the tangible sports, people will always see things through nostalgia colored glasses. Even though Ali used a combination of great size and great movement in the same way Fury did, but at 6 inches and 40 lbs smaller.
He will school Wilder yes, not sure about AJ. Thats the true fight for undisputed and greatness right there, AJ vs Fury at Wembley.
AJ will fight a beaten Wilder at the end of this year instead of the WBC champ Tyson Fury For real. Fury will fight his mandatory Dillian Whyte who will have beaten brezeale. AJ is an easier opponent for Fury than Wilder. Wilder is explosive and can be unpredictable. AJ is a big stiff robot with cement feet.
I'd only go top 30 on Joshua. Wilder and Fury are not there. We need Joshua, Wilder, Fury and Usyk to do what Hagler, Leonard, Duran, and Hears did. Fight each other. Then the we'll see where they stack up. Right now, all we saw is Fury get robbed into a draw vs Wilder.
I can agree with most of what you said. Just not that last part! AJ is currently the top dog at HW and will still be top dog until someone beats him and Im not so sure its Fury/.
Come on... AJ has a decent pedigree, but lineal champion and beating klit when and where he did... Fury for me. AJ has fought some good opponents but until he faces wilder or Fury I have to put him third.
Joshua- soldily carving out a claim to greatness. Fury- wasted a lot of time, but he is the guy who unseated Kilt, and should have a win over Wilder. Needs to get it together for a good collow-up. Wilder- thus far has done NOTHING whatsoever to be called great. A manufactured title reign against pastry chefs, school teacher, fat ****s, medically unfit, and his first hard fight he lost.
I mean, you can say that. And Mendoza, I often like your takes. But you don't really have any rationale confronting the rationale I put up. Empirically, they are there. 20 years from now, they will almost certainly have near consensus regard as being top 30 HW's or better. It always takes awhile for active fighters to get their due, but all the earmarks are there. If someone disagrees so strongly, they should list the fighters they rank from 20-30. I'd be glad to deconstruct in detail why some of the lower people on that list would rank lower than these three.
