The heavyweights really are crap, aren't they?

The division is indeed in a horriblre mess, that much is evident. However i'm looking forward to the future more than many people on here. I truly believe David Haye(28 ) will clear up, unify the division then (a)dissapear or (b)lose his 2nd/3rd defence after getting complacent. Along the way you have boxers like Odlanier Solis(28 ) who could be involved in a thrilling set of matches with David if he returns to the road to fulfill his potential, Alex Povetkin(28 ) can of course rule the division also, Chagaev if he loses his sick note, then you also have young guys like Boystov(22), Pianeta(23), and your Arreolla's, Dimitrenkos, K.Johnsons. You even have the prospect of guys like Alexeev moving up from cruiser is a few years. By 2010 I expect the top ten to be vastly different. All is not bad.

 

But he would not crack the top-20 today, no matter how horrible some might say the division is. It is a blemish on Marciano's record that this guy took him so far. Sorry, I can not be convinced otherwise.

 

if his stamina is so good, why did he crap out vs ross purrity in round 11 and why did he crap out against lamon brewster in round 5 so early in the fight?

 

That´s 4 years ago, don´t you think someone can improve his stamina in since then?

Also against Purrity it was his first 12 round fight, in all fights before he never went beyond the 8th round and this only once. It was a mistake of his management to put him in with a guy like Purrity who they could have known Wlad won´t knock out - i won´t talk about him fighting every month at the time of the Brewster fight Against Brewster he set a too fast pace and punched himself out. Big mistake of him and/or his trainer.
That aren´t excuses but it should make you clear that this two losses didn´t happen only due to his stamina but also due other reasons.

 

Watching how W. Klitschko reacted to Thompson's early pressure really makes me wonder how he would handle Joe Frazier in an imaginary match-up...

 

The heavyweight Joe Louis fought would mop up this division. Boxing has taken a turn for the worse. Talent IS a problem, so is conditioning and acctual fighting. When was the last truly 'great' heavyweight fight?

 

You do know that Marciano was in bed sick for a week the week before the fight, right?

 

Well, yeah, of course. If it only takes a Wladimir Klitschko to dominate the division (and he is dominating), Joe Louis need not be mentioned.

 

In my opinion there are at least 10 guys on Ali's resume' who would be unified champ today. Let me give you a hypothetical scenario. Get a mental picture of Klitscho/Iggy. Now take that version of Klitscho and replace Iggy with a prime Jerry Quarry.

 

Cockell was a hard man to knockout though, in regards to fighting for the Queen and nation pride, it makes a man stronger if they are told to fight for one's country. So Cockell put on a better showing. Also Marciano change his style from smashing them out with one or two bombs, to wearing and breaking them down as he done with LaSarza and Ezzard Charles. I dont hold the Cockell fight against him. Marciano did what he was suppose to do with Cockell, and win. Its just Cockell just keep getting up. He didnt get the clue. lol

It was not one of Marciano's best showings, Ali had more poor showings than Marciano, but no one holds the Benn or Wepner fights against Ali??

Evey fighter has a bad night, but Marciano had impressive nights against Walcott, Charles and Moore.

I was impress with Wlad, not a great fight, a bit sloppy(Stepping on his foot lol.) But when Wlad decided it was time for thompson to go, he did it.

 

Different fighter, different fight.

 

yup. and i know a sick wlad would have put the blob through the canvas in a minute.

look. you people like your fantasies and that is fine. i tell christians the same thing. enjoy, endulge yourselves.

 

I hold them against him. Ali turned into a fan (and judge) favorite, got away with outright cheating and extremely favorable calls. His 70's career is vastly over-rated, just as that entire era remains. Those guys just were not that good. The glow of the sun that was Ali illuminated all of them beyond the extent which there actual skills were capable.

 

Don Cockell rose in the rankings because Marciano had cleaned out most of the best fighters, and Archie Moore was cleaning out the rest.

Cockell was a decent boxer and he tapped out some points wins against LaStarza and Matthews, two men who were on a definitely downslide after being brutally beaten by Marciano.

1955 wasn't a strong year for contenders, Moore was clearly best qualified and got his shot.
Cockell was considered Rocky's first "easy defence", which all champions are "entitled" to (and most of them cash there's in before they get to their FIFTH defence).

Yes, Rocky laboured with Cockell, and fought a scruffy ugly fight, but nevertheless he beat Don's brains in quite brutally. That's what Rocky Marciano's all about, inflicting punishment, he didn't always look good doing so. Cockell was never the same again, got stopped early in his next two fights and retired.

Some of Rocky's pre-championship fights he got into torrid wars with guys who weren't even world championship contenders. He fought Art Henri and Red Applegate in 1951, shortly before he KO'd Rex Layne, and laboured a bit against both. A few months after beating Layne he beat Joe Louis impressively too. So in the same year, he looked a bit ordinary against a couple of nobodies, then knocked out two of the leading contenders in headline-grabbing showings. And it wasn't just that Marciano was improving, he simply wasn't an orthodox fighter and it couldn't be predicted how he'd look against "lesser" opponents. Some would say "he fought down to their level" but as Sam Silverman put it "Marciano could have as much trouble with an ordinary fighter as he did with the very top guys. Rocky never cared who he was fighting. He fought them all the same way."
And he always won.

Wladimir Klitschko's in a different position entirely. Where Marciano was UNDISPUTED champion, resting on the fact that he'd dramatically KO'd Walcott for the universally recognized crown, Wlad's champion by default, or if you like by the fact that he beat Chris Byrd (and please check Byrd's "champ" credentials, they were non-existent). Also, Wladimir has lost THREE times in his career, including once brutally (v. Sanders) when he was leading contender (and "heir-apparent" in many quarters), and since then too. And it's not just one "championship" fight where Wlad has looked less than spectacular. The Ibragimov showing was so bad he needs to do something electrifying to get real respect back.
The Thompson fight was far from the answer.

But I wont be too harsh on Wlad, he's winning at the moment and I cant expect much more from him. He's only as good as he is. And since he's probably the best out there, it's the general standard that people aren't happy with rather than individual fighters.

 

Wladimir actually had a injury against Purrity and was fighting faaaar too actively considering that.