The Importance of Punch Resistance in Boxing

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by MetalMandible, Jun 19, 2012.


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  1. MetalMandible

    MetalMandible Chinchecker Full Member

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    Hi folks, time for a bit of Chin Talk. We are going to analyze the Top 10 ATGs from the traditional eight divisions as per The Ring Magazine and see if we can find a common thread between them. Let's start.

    Heavyweight

    01. Muhammad Ali - Iron Chinned Warrior
    02. Joe Louis - Chinny
    03. Evander Holyfield - Iron Chinned Warrior
    04. George Foreman - Iron Chinned Warrior
    05. Larry Holmes - Iron Chinned Warrior
    06. Rocky Marciano - Iron Chinned Warrior
    07. Sonny Liston - Solid Chin
    08. Joe Frazier - Solid Chin
    09. Jack Johnson - Chinny
    10. Jack Dempsey - Iron Chinned Warrior

    Light Heavyweight

    01. Ezzard Charles - Glass Jaw
    02. Archie Moore - Glass Jaw
    03. Michael Spinks - Solid Chin
    04. Tommy Loughran - Solid Chin
    05. Bob Foster - Chinny
    06. Jimmy Bivins - Solid Chin
    07. Harold Johnson - Solid Chin
    08. Maxie Rosenbloom - Iron Chinned Warrior
    09. Billy Conn - Iron Chinned Warrior
    10. Matthew Saad Muhammad - Glass Jaw

    Middleweight

    01. Harry Greb - Iron Chinned Warrior
    02. Ray Robinson - Iron Chinned Warrior
    03. Carlos Monzon - Iron Chinned Warrior
    04. Marvin Hagler - Iron Chinned Warrior
    05. Jake LaMotta - Iron Chinned Warrior
    06. Charley Burley - Iron Chinned Warrior
    07. Tiger Flowers - Glass Jaw
    08. Stanley Ketchel - Iron Chinned Warrior
    09. Mickey Walker - Solid Chin
    10. Billy Conn - Iron Chinned Warrior

    Welterweight

    01. Ray Robinson - Iron Chinned Warrior
    02. Henry Armstrong - Iron Chinned Warrior
    03. Kid Gavilan - Iron Chinned Warrior
    04. Charley Burley - Iron Chinned Warrior
    05. Ray Leonard - Iron Chinned Warrior
    06. Carmen Basilio - Iron Chinned Warrior
    07. Jose Napoles - Iron Chinned Warrior
    08. Tommy Ryan - Iron Chinned Warrior
    09. Joe Walcott - Chinny
    10. Emile Griffith - Solid Chin

    Lightweight

    01. Roberto Duran - Iron Chinned Warrior
    02. Benny Leonard - Glass Jaw
    03. Pernell Whitaker - Chinny
    04. Joe Gans - Chinny
    05. Ike Williams - Solid Chin
    06. Joe Brown - Glass Jaw
    07. Carlos Ortiz - Iron Chinned Warrior
    08. Tony Canzoneri - Iron Chinned Warrior
    09. Bob Montgomery - Glass Jaw
    10. Beau Jack - Solid Chin

    Featherweight

    01. Willie Pep - Chinny
    02. Henry Armstrong - Iron Chinned Warrior
    03. Sandy Saddler - Iron Chinned Warrior
    04. Freddie Miller - Iron Chinned Warrior
    05. Kid Chocolate - Solid Chin
    06. Johnny Kilbane - Solid Chin
    07. Salvador Sanchez - Iron Chinned Warrior
    08. Alexis Arguello - Solid Chin
    09. Eusebio Pedroza - Glass Jaw
    10. Johnny Dundee - Solid Chin

    Bantamweight

    01. Carlos Zarate - Solid Chin
    02. Eder Jofre - Iron Chinned Warrior
    03. Ruben Olivares - Chinny
    04. Manuel Ortiz - Iron Chinned Warrior
    05. Panama Al Brown - Iron Chinned Warrior
    06. Pete Herman - Iron Chinned Warrior
    07. Johnny Coulon - Chinny
    08. Kid Williams - Solid Chin
    09. Joe Lynch - Iron Chinned Warrior
    10. Sixco Escobar - Iron Chinned Warrior

    Flyweight

    01. Jimmy Wilde - Solid Chin
    02. Miguel Canto - Glass Jaw
    03. Pascual Perez - Solid Chin
    04. Frankie Genaro - Solid Chin
    05. Benny Lynch - Iron Chinned Warrior
    06. Pancho Villa - Iron Chinned Warrior
    07. Fidel LaBarba - Iron Chinned Warrior
    08. Terry Allen - Glass Jaw
    09. Peter Kane - Glass Jaw
    10. Midget Wolgast - Glass Jaw

    As you can see, the majority of these 80 ATG fighters are Iron Chinned Warriors or at the least in possession of a Solid Chin with just 9 fighters having iffy whiskers and 12 having confirmed Glass Jaws. I think this emphasizes the point that having a Solid Chin is crucial to success in Boxing and is THE most important asset for a fighter to have.
     
    MetalMandible, Jun 19, 2012
    MetalMandible, Jun 19, 2012
    #1
  2. mclovellin87

    mclovellin87 el Terrible Full Member

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    If it is THE most important asset then wouldn't there be ONLY fighters with 'iron' or 'solid' chins in your list?
     
    mclovellin87, Jun 19, 2012
    mclovellin87, Jun 19, 2012
    #2
  3. Boxing Fanatic

    Boxing Fanatic Loyal Member banned

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    jr will have a chance against sergio if they ever fight

    will he win that is another story. i think sergio stops him, hes easy to hit and sergio is quite athletic and faster than him. but, would i be surrpised if he ko sergio? no, hes a tough arse mofo, he could walk right thru sergios power shots and kho
     
    Boxing Fanatic, Jun 19, 2012
    Boxing Fanatic, Jun 19, 2012
    #3
  4. knockout artist

    knockout artist Boxing Addict banned

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    Fantastic thread MM, you have indeed identified an irrefutable correlation between fighters having good to great chins, and going on to great success in the sport of boxing. Of course, some of these fighters had less than solid chins (Pep, Whitaker, B.Leonard), but their phenomenal defence allowed them to get away with this weakness to a degree.

    Interestingly there is a lack of iron chinned warriors in the LHW division, I'm sure this is coincidental.

    Comparing this to a thread I saw the other day, I think we can safely conclude that having an iron chin is more important than having huge punching power. Imagine if Tommy Hearns had Ray Robinson's chin
     
    knockout artist, Jun 19, 2012
    knockout artist, Jun 19, 2012
    #4
  5. Hands of Iron

    Hands of Iron #MSE Full Member

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    Holyfield at #3 with no Lewis or Tyson. :lol:
     
    Hands of Iron, Jun 19, 2012
    Hands of Iron, Jun 19, 2012
    #5
  6. Arranmcl

    Arranmcl Arran Full Member

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    Absolutely fantastic spot of chin talk going on here MM, great thread. Your knowledge of so many fighters punch resistance throughout all weight classes is outstanding and your point is put across with FACTS to back it up. Punch resistance is THE most important attribute a fighter can have.
     
    Arranmcl, Jun 19, 2012
    Arranmcl, Jun 19, 2012
    #6
  7. turbotime

    turbotime Hall Of Famer Full Member

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    No Tommy Hearns at 147. :huh

    Interesting. I can see why, just interesting.

    Also I feel like Holmes had more of a solid chin, not exactly an ICW.
     
    turbotime, Jun 19, 2012
    turbotime, Jun 19, 2012
    #7
  8. Hands of Iron

    Hands of Iron #MSE Full Member

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    I think he deserves it, although his recuperative powers were even greater.
     
    Hands of Iron, Jun 19, 2012
    Hands of Iron, Jun 19, 2012
    #8
  9. turbotime

    turbotime Hall Of Famer Full Member

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    Mandible that's a ****ing awful top 10 heavyweight list you have though.
     
    turbotime, Jun 19, 2012
    turbotime, Jun 19, 2012
    #9
  10. MetalMandible

    MetalMandible Chinchecker Full Member

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    No. Just because it is THE most important asset doesn't mean that a lack of Chin cannot be overcome by a talented AND skilled enough fighter, it is just rare, hence why there is small pool of Chinny fighters in this company of ATGs.

    I think the last paragraph sums it up. Hearns' with SRR's Chin is possibly the greatest of all-time. He lost his biggest fights because of his Chin and all the power, athleticism, and skill he possessed went out the window in those cases.

    As for the LHW division, I had the same thought when I was rating their Chins. Very strange indeed that the majority of ATG LHWs did not have good Chins.

    I didn't make the lists and I disagree heavily with Holyfield being placed that high, but The Ring's Rankings are generally acceptable to most everyone so I went with that.

    :good

    Great to see that the good denizens of ESB are finding the ChinCheckers' education efforts helpful and waking up to the Fact that having a Chin is critical in Boxing.

    Yeah, the lack of Hearns was a head scratcher for me, as well, but again, I didn't select the fighters, I merely rated their Chins and I stick by my assessment of Holmes' Chin. Getting raped by a Prime Tyson when he was clearly past it does not really reflect poorly on the man's punch resistance and he took savage shots throughout the bulk of his career and stood up to all of them.
     
    MetalMandible, Jun 19, 2012
    MetalMandible, Jun 19, 2012
    #10
  11. turbotime

    turbotime Hall Of Famer Full Member

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    That's the RING's all-time Heavyweight list!? :ibutt

    Cool on the Holmes, I wasn't really rating it alone on losing to Mike Tyson but he was hurt and put down his fair share, in an era that really wasn't full of heavyweight savages.
     
    turbotime, Jun 19, 2012
    turbotime, Jun 19, 2012
    #11
  12. P5_Boricua

    P5_Boricua Active Member Full Member

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    If the most important thing is a chin then put good ol margacheato in there!!! lol
    A chin is very important in boxing but we have seen many great fighters with no chins become something in this sport because of there defense
     
    P5_Boricua, Jun 19, 2012
    P5_Boricua, Jun 19, 2012
    #12
  13. Arranmcl

    Arranmcl Arran Full Member

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    **** off, YDKSAC
     
    Arranmcl, Jun 19, 2012
    Arranmcl, Jun 19, 2012
    #13
  14. forreal

    forreal Chin doctor Full Member

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    Feb 14, 2012
    Superb thread MM :clap:

    Irrefutable evidence that punch resistance is one of the most basic and important things in boxing..
    This thread should be a sticky :deal
     
    forreal, Jun 19, 2012
    forreal, Jun 19, 2012
    #14
  15. Collie

    Collie Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Good chin/punch resistance
    Heart/desire
    Power
    Speed
    Defence
    Accuracy
    Intelligence
    Ring-craft/agility
    Ability to adapt and adjust
    Attitude/disipline

    ^^
    All of these things are important in boxing. One doesn't become an all time great by not possessing many/most of these, including a good chin. Its not rocket science: If you are a boxer with a suspect chin you are more likely to lose and hence not be considered an ATG. It is possible to compensate in certain areas, e.g. Ali didn't have explosive power but still knocked out other greats, Willie Pep won a round without throwing a punch because his defence was so great, etc. Ray Robinson is often considered the best P4P probably because he had no clear weakness: he 'had it all' as they say. I'm sure boxing history is littered with people who possessed many of these attributes but fell down on one or two areas of weakness, who would have been all time greats 'if only', possibly the most important of these being the possession of a solid chin.

    Interesting thread and knowledgeable but I'm surprised if people don't already know that a good chin is very important, especially to be make it as an ATG.

    P.S. Are those official Ring top 10 ratings? Where did you access them?
     
    Collie, Jun 19, 2012
    Collie, Jun 19, 2012
    #15
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