The Marquez that fought Pac vs Mayweather at 147...

:deal. Even with those steroids Marquez took the best would still be 11-1/10-2. Floyd whooped this dude, this same dude who the "demigod" Morales ducked his whole career.

 

Virtually all of Floyd's opponents have been less skilled than Marquez, and won clear rounds. It's more than a gap in skill. The JMM that fought Pac would likely not do better but *****s need to stop acting like this fight would look exactly the same at 130.

 

total domination still. floyd is clearly that much better that even if you give marquez all the advantages and pee that he needs it'll still be wide.

 

You're right, it wouldn't look exactly the same. At 130 Marquez goes to sleep. But let me ask you, how can you see this not being the same. Floyd's boxing skills, his intelligence, reach, speed, all will still be there, something Marquez was unable to contend with. Marquez is good, but Floyd is better. Boxing is a game of inches, and Floyd has the precise measurement to tag Marquez and not get hit back, so even with the steroids he fought poochiao with, he'd still lose the same way because the fight wouldn't be fought so differently.

 

fight could have been better when FMJ was at SFW.

 

How? As I said before, Marquez's best bet was to engage Floyd and bait his counters so that he could dip inwards and counter the counters with combinations. Over all 12 rounds, despite being virtually shut out, Marquez was able to land something of significance in almost every one. Most notably was the over hand right, which Marquez threw from a low angle over Floyd's shoulder, either as a counter, or finishing up a combination that distracted Floyd's defensive focus. In one round, he even jabbed to draw out Floyd's left hook, pulled back from it, and came back with a right. This move often ended up with JMM on the inside, and as you can see from the pics I posted before, the size discrepancy today of their frames is more dramatic than it would have been at 130; there, Marquez was able to hold his own on the inside with a still strong Barrera, and so the clinch wouldn't have been so easy for Floyd to simply shove JMM out of before he got to throw another punch or two. He still has a size advantage, but it's not so pronounced. The defensive guard on the inside is also a skill that Floyd didn't really have as specialized at 130, as he was getting moved around and tagged by Chavez and Augustus up close (though he was still really good.)

And besides the diminished strength advantage Floyd would have, Marquez himself would be a sharper, quicker fighter, and wouldn't have his small frame weighed down by any muscle (he told Emmanuel Steward that he already had to put on weight beyond regular strength training to compete at 135.) His footwork was quite nimble at 130, and while Floyd's foot-speed was incredible at 130, he always moved around disengaged; were Marquez to follow up on a landed counter by closing the distance while Floyd backpedaled into a corner, he'd be able to reach him a bit more often than he did at WW. His punches would have more of an effect (he's not going to hurt Floyd, but he can make him pause to reset as he often does when hit), and would land with more speed and sharpness. On top of that, stylistically, Floyd was more offensively careless, and neglected to throw at shoulder level, sometimes reaching; good news for an in-the-pocket counter-puncher like Marquez.

Ultimately, Floyd's style is never convenient for Marquez, and Marquez might never be able to overcome it, as many suggest (and I'm fine with people adopting that notion). But I can guarantee the fight would not look the same, as the snippets of success he was having against Floyd wouldn't be neutralized so easily by the many factors I laid out already. I respect Floyd as an amazing fighter with ATG abilities, but my own preferences for Marquez aside, you have to ask yourself why the most skilled and well-rounded of Floyd's opponents was one of the least successful in securing rounds, and lesser, more brute fighter were able to steal more at 140 & above. Part of that was style, but part of that was a size discrepancy exasperating the obstacles of a blown up & aging featherweight.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kuZvo6IF528[/ame]

(This vid is bad quality, it simply highlights some of the maneuvers I was speaking of before.)

 

Sorry, but you cant compare the skillset of Khan to that of Mayweather.

The way I see it, both Marquez and Mayweather are on the same league as far as boxing skill is concerned.

Where Mayweather seperates himself is with his physical advantages.
The higher in weight they fight, the more advantages Mayweather has.

Bogatazo makes great points in this thread. Marquez needed to get in close and fight Mayweather at closer quarters. Marquez could'nt do that with Mayweather at 147 lbs because at that weight and with Marquez testing it for the first time at that weight in his career, Mayweather was by far phsically stronger on the inside.

At Bogatazo has stated, the advantage in strenghth Mayweather had over Marquez at 147 lbs is narrowed significantly to the point where Mayweather likelly does not have that advantage over Marquez at 130 lbs, and which when Marquez reached Mayweather there on the inside, Mayweather would not be able to bully and place Marquez where ever he wanted by just using his physicality with his arms, elbows and leg strenghth!

 

we don't know that for sure. take a look of what happened to cotto when he drained 1 pound less than his previous fight against pac.

had floyd not pussied out to the weight he agreed to, draining double to what cotto did, floyd would have been dominated....maybe even ko'd.

 

It's not JMM's skill level, it's not the weight, it's the two fighters and their respective styles that make this fight a whitewash...Floyd doesnt respect JMM's power, hence he will go where he wants, do what he wants, and can throw punches anytime he wants, with that kind of freedom Floyd can't be beaten or really even bothered.

 

Well "we" might not know, but I know...

 

I think he'd respect his power at 130, and regardless, Floyd will almost always avoid getting hit if he can, regardless of the power behind it. I outlined my whole take on potential pro-JMM dynamics of a bout at 130 on this page already, so any thoughts concerning that will be found there, too exhausted to continue further.

 

Thanks, but I never saw those pictures you speak of, do you happen to have the link.

 

Sure thing :good

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Thanks

 

Pac fought a heavier and older JMM

Using your logic, JMM was even heavier therefore even worse, not to mention older, when he schooled Pac again.