The MMA History Resources Thread

Discussion in 'MMA Forum' started by cross_trainer, Jul 8, 2007.


  1. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    Much more to come shortly...





    Ancient


    Pankration: Interpreting the Art
    http://ejmas.com/jalt/jaltframe.htm

    Pankration Project (Reconstruction)
    http://www.historical-pankration.com/

    Pankration: What It Was
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pankration
    http://www.discoverychannelasia.com/martial_arts/europe/pankration/index.shtml
    http://www.fightingarts.com/reading/article.php?id=164
    http://www.newsfinder.org/site/more/pankration_an_ancient_martial_art/

    Dioxippus
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dioxippus

    Arricheon
    http://ejmas.com/jcs/jcsart_hollenback_0903.htm
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/3534988.stm

    Greek Combat Sports
    http://www.neh.gov/news/humanities/2004-07/natureofgame.html

    Submission Fighting and the Rules of Ancient Greek Wrestling
    http://www.judoinfo.com/research8.pdf

    Sons of Apollo: Ancient Greek Boxing
    http://www.eastsideboxing.com/news.php?p=4686&more=1
    http://www.eastsideboxing.com/news.php?p=4805&more=1

    Ancient Greek Boxing
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_Greek_Boxing

    Greek Wrestling
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greek_Wrestling

    Famous Greek Athletes
    http://www.mlahanas.de/Greeks/Athletes.htm

    Pankration Illustrations
    http://www.utexas.edu/courses/cc304c3/pankration/pankration.html

    Historical Union of Pankration
    http://www.pankration.freesurf.fr/iupad/

    More Ancient Greek Wrestlers, Boxers, Pankratists
    http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/Olympics/pankration.html



    1100-1718

    Petter's Worstel-Konst
    http://ejmas.com/jwma/jwmaframe.htm

    Cornish Wrestling
    http://ejmas.com/jwma/jwmaframe.htm
    http://ejmas.com/jwma/jwmaframe.htm

    Glima
    http://ejmas.com/jwma/jwmaframe.htm

    Purring
    http://ejmas.com/jmanly/jmanlyframe.htm

    Talhoffer's Fechtbuch
    http://www.thearma.org/Manuals/talhoffer.htm

    Fiore Dei Liberi's Fechtbuch
    http://www.the-exiles.org.uk/fioreproject/default.asp
    http://www.aemma.org/onlineResources/liberi/contents.htm
    http://www.thearma.org/essays/FDL_studyguide.v3.htm


    1718-1822

    American "Rough and Tumble"
    http://ejmas.com/jmanly/articles/2001/jmanlyart_gorn_0401.htm

    Captain John Godfrey's Treatise Upon the Useful Science of Defence, 1747
    http://www.sirwilliamhope.org/Library/Godfrey/
    http://ahfaa.org/1747.htm
    Fewtrell's Science of Manual Defence, 1790http://www.sirwilliamhope.org/Library/Fewtrell/

    Extracts From Mendoza's Treatise on Boxing, 1791
    http://www.sirwilliamhope.org/Library/Mendoza/

    Ken Pfrenger's Google Video Lecture on Mendozan Pugilism

    http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5618795638343715291&q=mendoza+seminar&total=2&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plinde x=0

    Sir Thomas Parkyns' Close-Hugg Wrestler, 1713http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acro...tsparkyns.html

    IBHOF "Pioneer" Section
    http://www.ibhof.com/ibhfrost.htm

    Cyber Boxing Zone--Bareknuckle Champions of England
    http://www.cyberboxingzone.com/boxing/barenuk.htm

    Cyber Boxing Zone--Bareknuckle Champions of America

    http://www.cyberboxingzone.com/boxing/bare-am.htm

    Traditional Boxing Thread @ Martial Arts Planet
    http://www.martialartsplanet.com/for...ad.php?t=20504

    Martial Arts to 1699
    http://www.ejmas.com/kronos/NewHist1350-1699.htm

    1822-1860

    Layton's Norfolk Wrestling, 1830's
    http://www.the-exiles.org/manual/norfwres/norfwres.htm

    Savate
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Savate
    http://www.bridgemansavate.com/H1historical.html
    http://www.savateontario.ca/about-history.html

    Donald Walker's Wrestling, 1840
    http://www.geocities.com/cinaet/walker.html



     
  2. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    Yep...a brief vacation sidetracked me. :good
     
  3. younghypnotiq

    younghypnotiq Boxing Addict Full Member

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    this is great. im a big fan of oldschool stuff lke john sullivan, and the marquees of queensbury, and gama, and pankration. etc
     
  4. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    1860-1914

    More Savate

    http://ejmas.com/jmanly/articles/2001/jmanlyart_smith_0601.htm

    Price's Science of Self Defence, 1867

    http://www.geocities.com/cinaet/price.html

    Sorakichi Matsuda
    http://ejmas.com/jalt/jaltframe.htm

    Kentsu Yabu
    http://ejmas.com/jcs/jcsframe.htm

    Leonard vs. Higashi
    http://ejmas.com/jcs/jcsframe.htm

    Bartitsu
    http://ejmas.com/jmanly/articles/2001/jmanlyart_noble_0301.htm
    http://ejmas.com/jmanly/jmanlyframe.htm
    http://ejmas.com/jmanly/articles/2002/jmanlyart_Barton-Wrighta_1202.htm
    http://ejmas.com/jmanly/articles/2002/jmanlyart_Barton-Wrightb_1202.htm
    http://ejmas.com/jmanly/articles/2001/jmanlyart_japantimes_1001.htm
    http://ejmas.com/jmanly/articles/2001/jmanlyart_sandows_0301.htm

    John McMahon
    http://ejmas.com/jmanly/articles/2002/jmanlyart_hewitt_0602.htm

    Comparison of Combatives
    http://ejmas.com/jmanly/articles/2001/jmanlyart_beare_1201.htm

    A Plea for Style in Boxing
    http://ejmas.com/jmanly/jmanlyframe.htm

    A Bout With Gloves
    http://ejmas.com/jmanly/jmanlyframe.htm

    Rules for Scientific Boxing
    http://ejmas.com/jmanly/jmanlyframe.htm

    Frank Gotch
    http://ejmas.com/jmanly/articles/2001/jmanlyart_hewitt_0901.htm

    Punching Bags of Pugilism
    http://ejmas.com/jmanly/articles/2001/jmanlyart_myers_0801.htm

    Canadian Wrestling
    http://ejmas.com/jmanly/articles/2001/jmanlyart_leyshon1_0701.htm
    http://ejmas.com/jmanly/articles/2001/jmanlyart_leyshon2_0701.htm

    Savate
    http://ejmas.com/jmanly/articles/2001/jmanlyart_smith_0601.htm

    The Terrible Turk
    http://ejmas.com/jmanly/articles/2001/jmanlyart_noble_0501.htm

    Yukio Tani
    http://ejmas.com/jalt/jaltart_Noble_1000.htm

    Gama
    http://ejmas.com/jalt/jaltart_noble_0502.htm
    http://ejmas.com/jalt/jaltart_noble_0602.htm
    http://ejmas.com/jalt/jaltart_noble_0702.htm
    http://ejmas.com/jalt/jaltart_noble_0802.htm

    John L. Sullivan
    http://www.ibhof.com/sullivan.htm
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_L._Sullivan

    1918-1945


    Tamura vs. Pojello (wrestler vs. boxer), 1943

    http://ejmas.com/jalt/jaltframe.htm

    Carlos Gracie
    http://www.graciemag.com/?c=148&a=3781
    http://www.graciemag.com/?c=148&a=462

     
  5. younghypnotiq

    younghypnotiq Boxing Addict Full Member

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    do you guys think gama could beat current greats?
     
  6. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    Gama? Doubtful. While he had magnificent takedowns, he had no ground game and no striking game. Now, in a street fight on concrete, it might be a different story--those throws would be vastly more damaging under such circumstances.
     
  7. younghypnotiq

    younghypnotiq Boxing Addict Full Member

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    oo. sorry i wasnt familiar with the rules. i thought wrestleing back then was the equivilant of MMA. Bareknuckle was closer to MMA right? also what do you think about sullivan vs MMA fighters nowadays? and my final question was i was reading some thing on Boxing vs Wrestling and they said wrestling in the USA in the early 1900s was different then what it is today? was therea big difference or no?
     
  8. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    Wrestling back in the day was real, though fixes were still more frequent than (for instance) in boxing. Matches were generally won via pin (as in amateur wrestling today), but submissions were also practiced...many of which have survived today in "catch" wrestling. One of the best manuals from this period:

    http://www.sandowplus.co.uk/Competition/Burns/lessons/lesson01.htm

    Pugilism was the closest you got to MMA for almost two hundred years--especially since it legalized the only major combat systems of the time (fisticuffs and above the belt wrestling). Sullivan might do well against fighters today if (and this is a big one) he can keep it standing. It's more likely, though, that he would be taken down and submitted.

    On the other hand, Sullivan would probably blitz through most of the guys in the early UFC's--I could see him having the same success as Royce or Shamrock, for instance.
     
  9. younghypnotiq

    younghypnotiq Boxing Addict Full Member

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    didnt they allow grappling back then? not UFC type where they are on the ground most of the time but couldnt you throw people? im looking for some manuals on boxing back there i found one on john L. sullivan i will post it up when i find it again
     
  10. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    They allowed you to throw your opponent. All holds above the waist were considered legal, and trips were also permitted. No shooting for the legs and no groundfighting.

    In short, it was probably enough to secure takedown defense against most guys who don't specialize in takedowns, which is why I would suspect that Sullivan and company would be able to blast through most of the early UFCs.
     
  11. younghypnotiq

    younghypnotiq Boxing Addict Full Member

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    thanks. do you have any manuals on bareknuckle boxing?
     
  12. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    There are some online, which are available on my "bareknuckle boxing resources" thread:
    http://www.eastsideboxing.com/forum/showthread.php?t=235

    There are also a few that have recently been republished. These are the publishers and books:

    http://www.lulu.com/sciwrestling
    http://stores.lulu.com/shillelagh
    http://stores.lulu.com/prof_william_miller
    http://www.amazon.com/Science-Boxin...8324810?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1184696609&sr=1-9
     
  13. younghypnotiq

    younghypnotiq Boxing Addict Full Member

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  14. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    1945-1967

    Kimura
    http://www.judoinfo.com/kimura.htm
    http://www.ebji.org/akeem/kimura.html
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Masahiko_Kimura
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BVE82gH-v-g
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lkDBflFtPIw

    Kimura vs. Gracie
    http://www.gracieacademy.com/fight.html
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2wO3dHUYwQ

    Helio Gracie
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helio_Gracie
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HMAu0A-vQm8
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=laeykfbOStw

    Carlson Gracie
    http://www.graciemag.com/?c=148&a=3877
    http://www.graciemag.com/?c=148&a=3820
    http://www.graciemag.com/?c=147&a=4068

    Gene Lebell
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gene_LeBell
    http://www.usmaf.org/bio/lebell/index.html
    http://www.genelebell.com/bio.html
    http://www.genelebell.com/product-15.html

    Jon Bluming
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jon_Bluminghttp://ejmas.com/blumingad.htm
    http://www.jonbluming.com/
    http://ejmas.com/jcs/jcsart_bluming_0800.htm
    http://www.realfighting.com/0102/jonblubk.htm
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yPUpauO2a9k
    http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1998764980345828602&q=jon+bluming&total=5&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=0

    Anton Geesink
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anton_Geesink
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BtyWMKs7dp0
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=doRaneahGjw
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DnJN18fr0sA&NR=1

    1967-1993

    Bill Wallace
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Wallace_(martial_arts)
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=niJInl0d5sw
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kqay0quj5_o
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZRrPE1fF7a0
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NM9n4rJeE5k
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JubPpUnjIDw

    Joe Lewis
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_Lewis_(martial_arts)
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gX_A-Ynx3VA
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kqay0quj5_o

    Kickboxing History
    http://www.mikemiles.com/history1.html
    http://www.mikemiles.com/history2.html
    http://www.mikemiles.com/history3.html
    http://www.mikemiles.com/history4.html
    http://www.mikemiles.com/history5.html
    http://www.mikemiles.com/history6.html

    Benny Urquidez
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benny_Urquidez
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G7beh4v5c5c
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jsTPvsqpIgc
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jSsV3bOMWg0
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=37rUZxAS5RA
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4-fV5m-tQCs

    Joko Ninomiya (All-Japan Karate Champion) vs. Wing Chun Guy
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QH13kYFzfFk

    Rolls Gracie
    http://www.graciemag.com/?c=148&a=2839

    Rickson vs. Rei Zulu
    http://www.graciemag.com/?c=148&a=2871
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h8okuGYhpe8
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pV2kYJfB7zA

    Rickson Gracie
    http://www.graciemag.com/?c=148&a=2982
    http://www.graciemag.com/?c=148&a=3500

    Chris Dolman
    http://www.sherdog.net/forums/showthread.php?t=470952
    http://www.sherdog.net/forums/showthread.php?t=452260

    Antonio Inoki
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antonio_Inoki
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=29qI1GyhDeg
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8snHdY-VoLA
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9lXAGZtMxU8
    http://www.njpw.com/events/2003/1231/history.shtml
    http://www.njpw.com/about/all_roads.shtml
     
  15. andyZOR

    andyZOR Obsessed with Boxing banned

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