The Myth About Sugar Ray Leonard and Roberto Duran

Right. Won't persuade the "fake news" conspiracy theorists, but it seemed pretty convincing to me...

 

Duran was in shape.

 

Frankly, the idea that Leonard saw that Duran put on a lot of weight and scheduled the fight in November to catch him unprepared is so silly that I'm surprised people take it seriously. Even without the timeline that I put together, it's a childish story and illogical...doesn't pass the smell test. But a colorful story and motivated reasoning trump common sense and critical thinking 9 times out of 10.

 

Except he probably considers it flattering to the extent that it makes him look shrewd and smart. Especially after so many people (rightly) criticized him for fighting a dumb fight with a dumb fight plan the first time around.

 

But at the cost of making his second victory look like he only pulled it off against a weight drained Duran. If you're Leonard, it looks better to be able to say you only lost the first fight because you were goaded into it (He insulted Leonard's wife! Leonard was just doing what a man's gotta do! He's just as macho as Duran!), and then won the second as soon as you fought the guy with your trademark skills.

Your alternative argument about his motives is also a possibility, but I find it the less plausible of the two.

 

This is the truth, saw the same thing. Arcel even spoke of delaying the fight but Duran's manager Eleta said even if he loses we'll get more money in a third fight. This was the beginning of a funk Duran was in for a few years , one he didn't come out of till the Cuevas fight. The difference in Duran's performances after the age of 30 were literally night and day, it was so obvious sometimes that he wasn't properly prepared to fight, and as you say that's all on him. Looking back whenever Duran made really big money he slacked off, Leonard 1, After Hagler, and I thought he looked dull against Sugar Ray in the 3rd fight. He fought a good fight against Pazienza in the first fight and I thought he'd won, but in the second match he looked like he trained on his couch. Hindsight is fairly clear on him but at the time of his fights you never really knew if he would show up ready to fight or not. One quote by Ray Arcel on Roberto speaks volumes," If he had trained and stayed in shape like Barney Ross he'd have never lost"

 

I think it was obvious Duran didn't have the same intensity for the rematch. However, that's his own fault.

 

No, it is not exaggerated.

 

Right on a par with the "he fought Duran's fight" excuse that Leonard fans use for the first fight.

 

Leonard made different tactical decisions for the fights ands was added by Duran misreading it all . The joke was the rematch was pretty competitive until Duran lost his sh-t ..

 

Props for the Digital Underground in your sig.

On topic, I mentioned in the thread where @mrkoolkevin did his well-researched timeline (and included a link to a Washington Post article where a reporter is in Duran’s training camp in Miami, which further points out how well prepared he is) — this is actually Duran’s LONGEST layoff in years.

The book on Duran was get him in the ring again as soon as possible. The longer you wait, the more he’ll party. People think Duran would have knuckled down more if the fight was made for January? He would have just partied longer and gotten more out of shape.

Kevin’s timeline spells out how far in advance the fight was agreed upon. If Duran decided to keep partying, how the heck is that anyone’s fault but his? If anything, Duran’s camp should have been pushing to have it sooner, not later.

And it’s also completely documented that Leonard went to Hawaii after the first fight. He was beat up and depressed. Thinking about retiring. Then he went for a run on the beach and decided he wanted to avenge the defeat and called up Mike Trainer and said ‘make the fight.’

So whatever else Leonard may have said, he clearly decided he wanted Duran again immediately, like a week after the first fight. Now if you want to argue that Duran gained 40-50 pounds in a week, go right ahead, but Leonard was set on fighting Duran again before Roberto could have done too much partying.

And has it occurred to anyone that Duran was going to have to defend his title soon against someone, Leonard or not? He’s sat on it for nearly six month. They’re not going to let him keep it forever. If he doesn’t take the Leonard fight, he’s going to be defending for a lot less money against a guy that he’s less likely to be motivated to fight. In fact, I think it was Eleta who said they feared Duran would end up losing to a nobody if they didn’t get him back in the ring (which had been the way they did it all along during his career — give him less time to eat and party, not more).

Leonard’s side made a huge offer with guaranteed money. They also said if Duran isn’t interested, fine, we’ll fight Pipino instead. Duran’s side would have been fools not to accept.

If Duran, who spent years as lightweight champion, really thought he wasn’t going to have to defend the welterweight title … seriously? And that meant getting back in the gym. Which he did for Leonard — we have credible reports. Look at the guy in the ring — whether you think he’s in Montreal shape or not, he’s not out of shape. He’s not flabby or completely drained.

And take the worst case you may believe about Roberto’s conditioning for this fight — how does ‘I’m not at my best’ translate to ‘I’ll quit like a dog’? He wasn’t getting beat up. We’ve seen countless fighters in less than best shape — not to mention with broken hands or fighting one-armed, etc. — gut it out and try. It only takes one punch to turn around a fight. He quit because he was being outclassed and decided he didn’t like that.

 

IMO, Duran’s victory over Leonard was his absolute, pin point, peak performance - mind, body, soul and unbelievable experience plus malicious contempt and hate for Leonard (ala Frazier for Ali, FOTC), ladled on top, all these things in optimal alignment.

And, though Duran’s pressure did force Ray’s hand to some extent, Leonard still fought Duran’s fight and not his own. With all that, Leonard proved his chin and overall durability and it was still a very close fight in my book.

Ray was younger, he only stood to improve, learn immensely and become more self aware from the Montreal experience and be more soundly strategised in the return match.

I actually saw more reasons to favour an improved Leonard in the rematch while understanding that Roberto could not possibly improve on the sublime display in Montreal, rather, it would be a very difficult feat to replicate given Duran’s own age and already lengthy resume.

Duran wasn’t stupid, and I think he would’ve understood same. Sometimes fighters quit well before the actual fact of the fight - and Duran coming into the fight in less than ideal condition was maybe the first pre med step before the eventual No Mas.

The rematch was fairly close but it was still only the best part of 8 rounds and we would’ve likely seen Ray pull away exponentially thereafter.

It seems to be over sighted that Duran wasn’t getting any younger, with numerous tough fights before him and fighting above his best natural weight.

I think Duran’s random HL fights thereafter were more the natural exceptions - his lesser performances perhaps being the rule and reasonably expected all things considered re his age, long record and contesting in upper divisions.

 

Duran made Leonard fight his fight. Duran was incredibly motivated and conditioned.