The problem with Juan Manuel Marquez....

Zopilote · Nov 14, 2011

red cobra said: ↑

Pac will beat JMM decisively this time, and maybe like Duran beat DeJesus in their third fight...officially ending their trilogy. Pac by tko in 10.
Click to expand...

Wrong!

Zopilote · Nov 14, 2011

MasterStyle said: ↑

Marquez aa I guess isnt a clever guy, his tactics in the rings show that, and other instance, he still speaks only spanish.Couldnt those Mexicans fighting in US learn English?
Click to expand...

WRONG!!

In both accounts, Juan was speaking english in his interviews leading up to this fight, and he isnt all that bad really.

Zopilote · Nov 14, 2011

God damn it SILENCER, whats your take in the Pac-JMM fight?

Not trying to be a dick here regarding your other convo, but im just curious to know your opinion on this past Saturday's bout. :good

Zopilote · Nov 14, 2011

SILENCER said: ↑

Etu86 said: ↑

sorry zop,this dick is aggravating me...

I believe (as most) that Pac won the first two fights.

This fight....

I had Marquez up by a point at the end of the fight.

I'm a Pacquiao fan , Pacquiao didn't bring his A-game tonight, I think Marquez should have won, I'm really disappointed today As a boxing fan, I think, there was a slight injustice. Either draw or a Marquez win.

call me a cynic but the reason pac may have got the nod is because everyone wants to see the mayweather and pac fight still!! $$$$$$$$
Click to expand...

Although i do disagree with some of your opinions, much respect. :good
Click to expand...

Nay_Sayer · Nov 14, 2011

SILENCER said: ↑

Variation in ancient Egyptian stature and body proportions
Sonia R. Zakrzewski *
Department of Archaeology, University of Southampton, Southampton SO17 1BF, UK
Click to expand...

Here is what YOUR source has to say on the issue;

Body shape

Stature is comprised of contributions from several body portions, i.e., from the lower limb and from the trunk and cranium. The analyses performed on each individual bone were undertaken to see whether the small stature change found could be assigned to differences in growth of either the lower limb or the trunk (employing upper limb measurements as an indirect proxy for trunk size). Both upper and lower limb measurements (individual long bone lengths) exhibited significant change through time, although neither upper limb length (humerus radius) nor lower limb length (femur tibia) themselves exhibited significant change through time. All long bone lengths that changed display the same trend of increasing in length up until the start of the Dynastic period, and then decrease to the MK. None of the body ratios separating upper and lower portions exhibit statistically significant change through time. This pattern supports suggestions that the relative constancy of stature (i.e., the relatively low level of change through time) cannot easily be compartmentalized. This result is in agreement with previous research that found no significant change in body proportions between the Predynastic period and the Middle Kingdom (Masali, 1972; Robins, 1983).

The ancient Egyptians have been described as having a Negroid body plan (Robins, 1983). Variations in the proximal to distal segments of each limb were therefore examined. Of the ratios considered, only maximum humerus length to maximum ulna length (XLH/XLU) showed statistically significant change through time. This change was a relative decrease in the length of the humerus as compared with the ulna, suggesting the development of an increasingly African body plan with time. This may also be the result of Nubian mercenaries being included in the sample from Gebelein.

The nature of the body plan was also investigated by comparing the intermembral, brachial, and crural indices for these samples with values obtained from the literature. No significant differences were found in either index through time for either sex. The raw values in Table 6 suggest that Egyptians had the super-Negroid body plan described by Robins (1983). The values for the brachial and crural indices show that the distal segments of each limb are longer relative to the proximal segments than in many African populations (data from Aiello and Dean, 1990). This pattern is supported by Figure 7 (a plot of population mean femoral and tibial lengths; data from Ruff, 1994), which indicates that the Egyptians generally have tropical body plans. Of the Egyptian samples, only the Badarian and Early Dynastic period populations have shorter tibiae than predicted from femoral length. Despite these differences, all samples lie relatively clustered together as compared to the other populations.

Variation in Ancient Egyptian Stature and Body Proportions, Sonia R. Zakrzewski

[url]http://wysinger.homestead.com/egyptian_body_proportions.pdf[/url]
Click to expand...

Skeletal sampling was mainly restricted to sites from Middle and Upper Egypt so that all individuals would have experienced reasonably similar geographical and climatic conditions. Due to the lack of Old Kingdom (OK), skeletal remains from Upper Egypt and one series from Lower Egypt were also analyzed (Gizeh). Site locations are shown in Figure 1. Distances between sites are shown in Table 1.

The selection of skeletal material was mainly pragmatic. For most periods, all available material was assessed, although complete skeletons were preferred over crania alone, and complete crania were selected in preference to fragmentary material. Care was taken to maximize samples from all available time periods. The sampling was also limited by the selection of the material that had been removed from Egypt and thus available for study in museum and university collections. Many collections derive from early excavations, with only individuals of interest being shipped back to the European collector funding the excavation, and hence the material studied may not be completely representative of the cemetery population. Four collections were studied; the Duckworth Collection of the Department of Biological Anthropology in Cambridge, the Egyptian collection of the Natural History Museum in London, the Marro Collection of the Department of Anthropology and Biology in Turin, and the Reisner Collection of the Natural History Museum in Vienna.

A series of six time-period groups were studied, dating from the Badarian (c. 4000 BC) to the MK (c. 1900 BC). The periods studied were the Badarian, the Early Predynastic (EPD), the LPD, the EDyn, the OK, and MK. Samples (Table 2) were studied only if they could be reliably dated to one of the six periods. The dates in Table 2 are midpoint time period dates and generate a temporal distance matrix. For further details regarding the cemeteries, see Zakrzewski (2003). Analysis was limited to adult individuals, with maturity being determined on the basis of sphenooccipital fusion, full epiphyseal fusion, and complete eruption of the third molars.

The Badarian crania have been characterized by their small and gracile nature (Stoessiger, 1927; Morant, 1935; Strouhal, 1971; Gaballah et al., 1972), and their relatively high degree of facial prognathism (Stoessiger, 1927). The current study supports this description (being placed low on PC1 in Fig. 2, as a result of their short cranial vaults and narrow faces). Furthermore, their phenotypic homogeneity (Fig. 2, Table 5) has been demonstrated. As a result of their facial prognathism, the Badarian sample has been described as forming a morphological cluster with Nubian, Tigrean, and other southern (or \Negroid") groups (Morant, 1935, 1937; Mukherjee et al., 1955; Nutter, 1958, Strouhal, 1971; Angel, 1972; Keita, 1990). Cranial nonmetric trait studies have found this group to be similar to other Egyptians, including much later material (Berry and Berry, 1967, 1972), but also to be significantly different from LPD material (Berry et al., 1967). Similarly, the study of dental nonmetric traits has suggested that the Badarian population is at the centroid of Egyptian dental samples (Irish, 2006), thereby suggesting similarity and hence continuity across Egyptian time periods. From the central location of the Badarian samples in Figure 2, the current study finds the Badarian to be relatively morphologically close to the centroid of all the Egyptian samples. The Badarian have been shown to exhibit greatest morphological similarity with the temporally successive EPD (Table 5). Finally, the biological distinctiveness of the Badarian from other Egyptian samples has also been demonstrated (Tables 6 and 7).

Population Continuity or Population Change:
Formation of the Ancient Egyptian State (2007)
Sonia R. Zakrzewski

[url]
This content is protected
[/url]
Click to expand...

Why don't you try taking your head out of your ass and read what YOUR source is actually saying.

1 + 1 = 2, Genius...

Nay_Sayer · Nov 14, 2011

SILENCER said: ↑

This content is protected

This content is protected

Click to expand...

Once again you FAIL to understand the reasoning behind YOUR source's comparison of Ancient Egyptians to African Americans. Fact is, comparing Ancient Egyptians to African Americans is simply a case of comparing one African population to another. Since they are related populations there is naturally a similarity between the two. Both groups are Pan African and share common ancestry.

Main Events · Nov 14, 2011

Is this National Geographic?

Nay_Sayer · Nov 14, 2011

SILENCER said: ↑

actually in another thread you stated because it is an outdated ^^^

now we are back to using it are we?

Craniofacial criteria are no longer universally accepted as reliable indicators of population grouping or ethnicity.
Click to expand...

You CAN'T have it both ways, Genius. It was YOU and YOUR "archaeologist" friend who first used Zakrzewski as a source. Zakrzewski is YOUR source, NOT MINE. If you're going to use a particular source then you have to live with what YOUR source says.

1 + 1 = 2

YOUR SOURCE USES CRANIOMETRIC AND BODY PROPORTION EVIDENCE TO LINK ANCIENT EGYPTAINS TO OTHER BLACK AFRICAN POPULATIONS.

Again, Zakrzewski is YOUR SOURCE, not mine.

FACTS, learn to live with them.

Cableaddict · Nov 14, 2011

Get a room, you two !

Nay_Sayer · Nov 14, 2011

SILENCER said: ↑

you walked right into it
Click to expand...

Having a room temperature IQ is nothing to be proud of.

Nay_Sayer · Nov 14, 2011

SILENCER said: ↑

care to expain this?

it is well and truly over now nayslayed!! thanks for playing.
Click to expand...

You and your "archaeologist" friend have not addressed the Zakrzewski issue. I think you need to concern yourself with Zakrzewski before asking me to address anything.

Once again for those who have a problem reading their their OWN sources;

Body shape

Stature is comprised of contributions from several body portions, i.e., from the lower limb and from the trunk and cranium. The analyses performed on each individual bone were undertaken to see whether the small stature change found could be assigned to differences in growth of either the lower limb or the trunk (employing upper limb measurements as an indirect proxy for trunk size). Both upper and lower limb measurements (individual long bone lengths) exhibited significant change through time, although neither upper limb length (humerus radius) nor lower limb length (femur tibia) themselves exhibited significant change through time. All long bone lengths that changed display the same trend of increasing in length up until the start of the Dynastic period, and then decrease to the MK. None of the body ratios separating upper and lower portions exhibit statistically significant change through time. This pattern supports suggestions that the relative constancy of stature (i.e., the relatively low level of change through time) cannot easily be compartmentalized. This result is in agreement with previous research that found no significant change in body proportions between the Predynastic period and the Middle Kingdom (Masali, 1972; Robins, 1983).

The ancient Egyptians have been described as having a Negroid body plan (Robins, 1983). Variations in the proximal to distal segments of each limb were therefore examined. Of the ratios considered, only maximum humerus length to maximum ulna length (XLH/XLU) showed statistically significant change through time. This change was a relative decrease in the length of the humerus as compared with the ulna, suggesting the development of an increasingly African body plan with time. This may also be the result of Nubian mercenaries being included in the sample from Gebelein.

The nature of the body plan was also investigated by comparing the intermembral, brachial, and crural indices for these samples with values obtained from the literature. No significant differences were found in either index through time for either sex. The raw values in Table 6 suggest that Egyptians had the super-Negroid body plan described by Robins (1983). The values for the brachial and crural indices show that the distal segments of each limb are longer relative to the proximal segments than in many African populations (data from Aiello and Dean, 1990). This pattern is supported by Figure 7 (a plot of population mean femoral and tibial lengths; data from Ruff, 1994), which indicates that the Egyptians generally have tropical body plans. Of the Egyptian samples, only the Badarian and Early Dynastic period populations have shorter tibiae than predicted from femoral length. Despite these differences, all samples lie relatively clustered together as compared to the other populations.

Variation in Ancient Egyptian Stature and Body Proportions, Sonia R. Zakrzewski

[url]
This content is protected
[/url]
Click to expand...

Skeletal sampling was mainly restricted to sites from Middle and Upper Egypt so that all individuals would have experienced reasonably similar geographical and climatic conditions. Due to the lack of Old Kingdom (OK), skeletal remains from Upper Egypt and one series from Lower Egypt were also analyzed (Gizeh). Site locations are shown in Figure 1. Distances between sites are shown in Table 1.

The selection of skeletal material was mainly pragmatic. For most periods, all available material was assessed, although complete skeletons were preferred over crania alone, and complete crania were selected in preference to fragmentary material. Care was taken to maximize samples from all available time periods. The sampling was also limited by the selection of the material that had been removed from Egypt and thus available for study in museum and university collections. Many collections derive from early excavations, with only individuals of interest being shipped back to the European collector funding the excavation, and hence the material studied may not be completely representative of the cemetery population. Four collections were studied; the Duckworth Collection of the Department of Biological Anthropology in Cambridge, the Egyptian collection of the Natural History Museum in London, the Marro Collection of the Department of Anthropology and Biology in Turin, and the Reisner Collection of the Natural History Museum in Vienna.

A series of six time-period groups were studied, dating from the Badarian (c. 4000 BC) to the MK (c. 1900 BC). The periods studied were the Badarian, the Early Predynastic (EPD), the LPD, the EDyn, the OK, and MK. Samples (Table 2) were studied only if they could be reliably dated to one of the six periods. The dates in Table 2 are midpoint time period dates and generate a temporal distance matrix. For further details regarding the cemeteries, see Zakrzewski (2003). Analysis was limited to adult individuals, with maturity being determined on the basis of sphenooccipital fusion, full epiphyseal fusion, and complete eruption of the third molars.

The Badarian crania have been characterized by their small and gracile nature (Stoessiger, 1927; Morant, 1935; Strouhal, 1971; Gaballah et al., 1972), and their relatively high degree of facial prognathism (Stoessiger, 1927). The current study supports this description (being placed low on PC1 in Fig. 2, as a result of their short cranial vaults and narrow faces). Furthermore, their phenotypic homogeneity (Fig. 2, Table 5) has been demonstrated. As a result of their facial prognathism, the Badarian sample has been described as forming a morphological cluster with Nubian, Tigrean, and other southern (or \Negroid") groups (Morant, 1935, 1937; Mukherjee et al., 1955; Nutter, 1958, Strouhal, 1971; Angel, 1972; Keita, 1990). Cranial nonmetric trait studies have found this group to be similar to other Egyptians, including much later material (Berry and Berry, 1967, 1972), but also to be significantly different from LPD material (Berry et al., 1967). Similarly, the study of dental nonmetric traits has suggested that the Badarian population is at the centroid of Egyptian dental samples (Irish, 2006), thereby suggesting similarity and hence continuity across Egyptian time periods. From the central location of the Badarian samples in Figure 2, the current study finds the Badarian to be relatively morphologically close to the centroid of all the Egyptian samples. The Badarian have been shown to exhibit greatest morphological similarity with the temporally successive EPD (Table 5). Finally, the biological distinctiveness of the Badarian from other Egyptian samples has also been demonstrated (Tables 6 and 7).

Population Continuity or Population Change:
Formation of the Ancient Egyptian State (2007)
Sonia R. Zakrzewski

[url]
This content is protected
[/url]
Click to expand...

You need to pay attention to what YOUR source is saying and READ the above closely.

Nay_Sayer · Nov 14, 2011

SILENCER said: ↑

Etu86 said: ↑

apparently this isnt dealing with the dr z issue!
Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Actually, no it's not.

If your "archaeologist" friend could produce a coherent post, I would be glad to respond. As such, both you and your "archaeologist" friend have proven yourselves to be nothing more than the equivalent of one of the Einsteins who frequent Stormfront.

As soon as your friend starts posting in a coherent manner, I will gladly answer his posts, point for point.

And tell your friend that he needs to stick to the facts. I will not address his constant conjecture and unfounded assertions.

Nay_Sayer · Nov 14, 2011

SILENCER said: ↑

naysayer were did you get this pic? source please?
Click to expand...

You need to deal with the Zakrzewski issue instead of worring about where that artwork comes from. IIRC, that image is tomb art from Ramses II's tomb.

Pimp C · Nov 14, 2011

Pimp C said: ↑

I agree with it and have said as much. If JMM was smart he would just box Pac and not trade with him as much. When he boxes he wins when he trades with Pac and fights his fight he loses. The Mexican in him won't allow him to just box and he gets drawn into dumb brawls.
Click to expand...

Looks like JMM took my advice.:yep

Nay_Sayer · Nov 14, 2011

Gained said: ↑

-------------------

How unfortunate for you that the image is a fake photoshop darkened image that you been caught out again defeated afro clown

This content is protected

Lets see the ORIGINAL MURAL TOMB pix:Ramses II with Anubis is the Greek name for a jackal-headed god associated with mummification and the afterlife in ancient Egyptian religion

This content is protected

Too bad for you caught out by tampering with images again
Click to expand...

What are you, some type of drooling ******? Am I to believe the image I posted is a fake all because YOU, in all of your glorious intellectual splendor, says so?

I don't think so, Einstein..

Log in or Sign up

The problem with Juan Manuel Marquez....

Zopilote Dinamita Full Member

Zopilote Dinamita Full Member

Zopilote Dinamita Full Member

Zopilote Dinamita Full Member

Nay_Sayer On Rick James Status banned Full Member

Nay_Sayer On Rick James Status banned Full Member

Main Events Member Full Member

Nay_Sayer On Rick James Status banned Full Member

Cableaddict Boxing Junkie Full Member

Nay_Sayer On Rick James Status banned Full Member

Nay_Sayer On Rick James Status banned Full Member

Nay_Sayer On Rick James Status banned Full Member

Nay_Sayer On Rick James Status banned Full Member

Pimp C Too Much Motion

Nay_Sayer On Rick James Status banned Full Member

Log in or Sign up

Forums

The problem with Juan Manuel Marquez....

Zopilote Dinamita Full Member

Zopilote Dinamita Full Member

Zopilote Dinamita Full Member

Zopilote Dinamita Full Member

Nay_Sayer On Rick James Status banned Full Member

Nay_Sayer On Rick James Status banned Full Member

Main Events Member Full Member

Nay_Sayer On Rick James Status banned Full Member

Cableaddict Boxing Junkie Full Member

Nay_Sayer On Rick James Status banned Full Member

Nay_Sayer On Rick James Status banned Full Member

Nay_Sayer On Rick James Status banned Full Member

Nay_Sayer On Rick James Status banned Full Member

Pimp C Too Much Motion

Nay_Sayer On Rick James Status banned Full Member