Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by janitor, Jun 10, 2019.
Ships that did not pass in the night.
I agree. Foreman was a major multimillionaire from the grill deal.
Tony Canzoneri was a well liked, easy going guy. Yet he had so much heart it hurt him at the end of his career.
Baer was a slacker with questionable heart and discipline.
He blew it and arsed about , simple as in my opinion.
Took the other fellow totally lightly and paid the price.
his star power loses cred when he lost. Believe it or not people care about your illusion of invincibility , especially in movies.
Hardly an unfamiliar tale. It boils down to sex and power. Power and sex, one leads to the other, so the natural order says. Everything has to do with sex and continuation of the species. Being the top dog in a given profession is the "civilized" manifestation of that natural order that exists everywhere in the rest of the animal kingdom.
Once you get to the stage where you are officially the top guy around, commanding huge money and women throwing themselves at you and being perceived as the most powerful animal in your domain, your edge is then gone. The battle's over and won. That's the dichotomy of it. The thing you strive for over many years floats away into the ether the minute to attain it.
Wrong, the whole premise of the sport is that you win and lose IN THE RING. Period end of story. Again, if your lack of training made you not sharp or crisp and out of shape.... that helps to explain the performance. When you don't try AT ALL TO WIN, that has ZERO to do with outside the ring circumstances. You could have a great training camp, but if you don't try what will it matter?
I am well aware that Louis and Ali made a lot of money outside the ring, but that is not quite the same situation.
Here we have a case where the reigning heavyweight champion was making more money from acting, than he was from boxing.
He was not making money from lending his name to products, he was acting as a full time career!
That is not only special, it is possibly unprecedented!
Whatever you think of his opposition, the fact is that he secured the position of #1 contender twice during this period.
To claim that Dempsey was beating better men during his exhibition tour, is frankly ridiculous!
Don't you think that circumstances outside the ring impact a fighters motivation inside it?
That is neither special nor relevant.
Ali, Wladmir, Lennox, Andre Ward, Marciano, and RANDALL FREAKING COBB had acting gigs. Granted they didnt have as many roles as Baer but they got paid well and gave it all in training.
Lets look at the time line objectively:
First role: 1933
Won title: 1934
Lost title: 1935
Second role: 1935
Had a role in 37, & 38 then didnt have another movie till 42. He retired from boxing in 41. It wasn't till he hung them up that we see the majority of his acting.
He had an additional 30+ fights after losing the title. He was brutally Kod by Louis. I'll give him an asterisk* since he supposedly had a hand injury, he was coming off a loss, and it was joe freaking Louis. I wont give him ANY excuses for the Braddock loss.
What about the rest of his less than stellar career?
You had a few decent names like Farr, Wright, Comisky, and Galento. Guys who had good records. Some had good power or skill or both and all were veterans or ranked.
But then you have lots of very strange shoddy wins over guys making their debut, guys with more losses than wins, etc.
Although he beat Farr, he also lost to him the first time. Lost to a complete bum in Willie Davies. Lost to Nova twice. Never won the title again.
Now remember that there is a huge gap between his winning title in 34 and his last fight in 41. He starred in FOUR films spread out over 5 years of his 12 year career while he was an active boxer. The majority of all his acting came AFTER his career ended. You are attempting to spin this narrative that he was a constantly busy actor like a modern day Dwayne Johnson when this simply wasn't the case and can't be used as an excuse for him losing focus during the years he was an active fighter.
At the end of the day he simply didn't live up to his full potential. Even the most die hard fans of Tyson can admit this about their favorite fighter. Bowe fans admit this. Even Dempsey fans. Similar things have been said of Baer yet you are disagreeing with what is considered a unanimous opinion. Are you being a contrarian just for the sake of it?
Lennox is hardly the counter example I'd use.
I would actually.
Unlike Baer, he admits he lost focus, he avenged his embarrassing loss and regained his title. Baer has several unavenged embarrassing losses and never regained the title.
That just further proves my point. Lennox got the nickname "Lion" while Baer became a clown known more for his upset loss than anything he won.
Look Baer had serious star power .. He was good in Prizefighter and the Lady .. everyone loved him but he seemed to crash and burn real fast .. where were the sequels ? Physical he aged fast and badly .. I know he had some small films later on w Slapsy Maxie but his days as a film draw were pretty short. He gained weight and did not look healthy and ultimately died way too young.. a super likable guy that went far too quickly ..
What a ditzy statement. I’d say you can’t be serious but you are. Guess politics and jockeying for big money fights based on name recognition is a new boxing concept to you.
Good post that gets to the heart of things!