The top 10 modern heavyweights of all time

Tyson, Holy and Lewis have to be up there, in my opinion.

As do Foreman and Ali. Foreman regaining the legit title is extraordinary, obviously.

Larry Holmes, like Lewis, was not appreciated during his time, yet he is a dead cert in this list.

Frazier matched badly with Foreman, but he is one of the Greats regardless.

Need three more? Very well.

Bowe, Liston, and a klitschko bro'. You can't have both K' bro's in there as one has to dominate. They are separate fighters.

Even at that, I would like to see how their careers end up.

 

1. Muhammad Ali
2. George Foreman
3. Sonny Liston
4. Mike Tyson
5. Larry Holmes
6. Joe Frazier
7. Lennox Lewis
8. Evander Holyfield
9. Wladimir Klitschko
10. Vitali Klitschko

 

Did Joe Louis duck elmer ray before or after he knocked him out?

 

You need get a handel on two things here:

1. It is possible to fight predominantly black fighters over 200 lbs and still fight nothing but tomato cans.

2. It is not the colour of your oposition or their weight that is important but their ranking at the time you fight them.

In terms of number of ranked or world class oponents fought Louis pisses on Foreaman, Frazier and Tyson and is on alevel pegging with Muhamad Ali.

Hell he even beats them in terms of proving himself against bigger opponents. When did Ali, Frazier, Foreman or even Tyson prove themselves against a world class oponent the size of Primo Carnera or Buddy Baer?

 

In my humble opinion, trying to balance between accomplishments and head to head:

1)Ali
2)Holmes
3)Lewis
4)Tyson
5)Foreman
6)Holyfield
7)Frazier
8)Wlad Klitschko
9)Bowe
10)Vitali Klitschko

 

But then Bivins would come under the Cruiserweight group wouldn't he?
Louis could have fought Franklin or Ray ,but close scrutiny of their records shows why he didnt they were not consistant , something that applied to Thompson too.Lack of consistantcy carried through with the black heavies into the 50's, ,its as though they had a round robin, "whose turn is it to win tonight"
.Claims that Louis ducked black challengers are rather thin on examination,imo.
A little like Jeffries, who could have fought Johnson and Godfrey ,but more or less cleaned up everyone else,with any real chance.imo.

 

I think he may have ducked out of the way when Ray was falling to the canvas

 

Louis fought 4 former heavyweight Champs before he challenged for the title.
In his second year as a pro he fought
Perroni
Ramage
Barry
Brown
Toles
Carnera
Levinsky
Baer
Uzcudun
Only Perroni and Brown went the 10rds,of the others Carnera managed to last 6rds, in a onesided slaughter, no one else saw the 5th rd.
Louis was matched very strongly .who did he miss?

 

Ali
Holmes
Lewis
Liston
Holyfield
Tyson
V Kltischko
Bowe
Frazier
W. Klitschko

 

#1 Muhammad Ali
#2 Lennox Lewis
#3 Mike Tyson
#4 Larry Holmes
#5 George Foreman
#6 Joe Frazier
#7 Sonny Liston
#8 Evander Holyfield
#9 Riddick Bowe
#10 Ken Norton

 

1.ali
2.holmes
3.lewis
4.frazier
5.foreman
6.tyson
6.holyfield
8.liston
9.bowe
10.norton

 

1. Lewis
2. Holmes
3. Foreman
4. Wlad
5. Vitali
6. McCall
7. Ali
8. Holyfield
9. Tyson
10. Fraizer

 

I will have a stabb at a top 10 modern heavys. I will look at an overall rating of head to head, legacy, but most importantly an ability to win bouts through modern size and skill which was simply not possible with many of the older heavyweights.

For the record, Ali is out, because he is too small and his speed is something not seen in any modern heavys today. Holmes is out for the same reasons. Tyson, also is out, because he is far too short. Louis and Sonny Liston is out because he ducked the best black contenders.

1. Lennox Lewis - The perfect modern heavyweight. Size, Strength, Speed and skills. Plus he knew how to dominate his era without fighting his biggest challengers of his prime, like Holyfield, Tyson and Bowe until they were too old to put up a decent challenge. Also overcame adversity by learning to hide behind his jab.

2. Vladimir Klitchsko - Another Great, who had the ability to emerge as a completely new fighter after his three crushing KO defeats, by learning to hide behind his jab, although he did also add a John Ruiz style clinch to his repertoire. Definitely a modern Great.

3. Vitali Klitchsko - Big strong and shows modern skills way ahead of his field. Managed to turn a TKO loss to an old overweight fighter into a victory in the eyes of many people.

4. Riddick Bowe - Maybe a little hard done by. Had as much talent as the three above, but rather than get KOd use his modern skills and hide behind a jab and clinch, Riddick toughed out his tough fights and ended up earning wins, albeit by DQ, or reversing decisions to prime versions of the man who defeated him. On a plus side though, he pretty much ate himself out of contention, which is an evolutionary skill which simply wasnt around in the old primitive times.

5. Andrew Golota - Definitely the greatest modern fighter to never win a world title. Big Tall and strong, with you guessed it, a good jab and a clinch and reach advantage, he lost more World heavyweight title fights than anyone i can think of, but keeps coming back. His use of the modern technique referred to as the Don King Factor places hims right up the front of the field. If Sam Langford or Peter Jackson learned to use this tactic, they would be all time greats, but they were to primitive.

6. Nicolai Valuev - A master of the Modern skilled tactic. Paw Jab, Clinch repeat. Valuev is the biggest of all modern champions so he may very well be the best.

7. Primo Carnera - Paw Jab and Clinch, Paw Jab and clinch, and also dont forget to have the mob fix the fight. Primo May have been a little eccentric in the way the mob fixed the fights as opposed to the modern way which relies on Judges having off nights and contracts with option clauses for promoters, but his old fashioned ways were effective and who knows they might still work today. Primo was light years ahead of his time.

8. James Toney - Pure heart. Unlike old time fighters like Rocky Marciano who were simply naturally to small to bulk up, Toney showed all the benefits and use of Modern nutrition and training supplements to bulk up all the way to heavyweight and beyond. He is a one in a million talent in that he is a natural middleweight, but he can easily carry 230 to 250lbs or even more.

9. Jess Willard - All the attributes of a modern superheavyweight. Big and Strong but he may struggle against the very latest fighters in that he only really has the skills to Jab and clinch. and perhaps Knock fighters out with hooks uppercuts or right hands also, but he doesnt really have the full skill set of the modern fighters. He is particularly lacking in the Television area, as film shows clearly that he was a dull and colourless fighter. Might be a controversial inclusion.

10. This is a really hard decision because there are so many great fighters to squeeze into this position. Corey Sanders - KOd a Klitchsko, Corey 'T Rex' Sanders has the same name as someon who KOd a Klitchsko, Lamon Brewster - Once drugged a Klitchsko, David Haye - Once made fun of a klitchsko and signed to fight both Klitchskos. Kali Meehan - Got ripped off in a fight against the man who beat a Klitchsko. It really is a tough decision, but i am going to go with a controversial selection and go with the fighter who i say has to be underated, because he did the impossible and is given zero credit. Plus he pioneered a revolutionary form of the rope a dope to get his biggest win, with the legendary Let him punch himself out theory. In fact, while i havent seen his biggest win, i am told by many fans that like when Pep won a round without throwing a punch, It seems as though Ross Purity defeated a Klitchsko without landing or throwing a punch, but simply by letting Klitchsko exhaust himself. Something that only a modern super heavy could even hope to do.

 

Not True. Tiger Jack Fox, Jack Trammel, Leroy Haynes, Eddie Blunt at some point in time were all very worhty challengers to a young upcoming joe louis.

Louis lost 3 years due to war. I believe had he not gone to the war, he would have risked his title vs top black fighters. So I do not hold this against him


However here are some top black men he failed to fight

Before the War

# 2 rated Lem Franklin in 1941..on a 19-0 with 17 knockout winning streak, including 5 round knockout over Abe Simon. Simon however got a REMATCH with Louis instead. Very fishy.


After the War

Elmer Ray- On a 65-1 winning streak with wins over Prime Hall of famers Walcott and Charles, including a brief Number 1 ranking. He could have squeezed Ray in there with all the time he took off between conn and walcott fight.


Lee Q Murray and Jimmy Bivins were both Outstanding Challengers, but these men had there best success during the war...Both duration champions. Louis was not around so he canot be critisisized. I suspect Louis would have fought both had he been around.

 

V Klitschko over Wladimir Klitschko? :huh Is that a joke? Wlad is not only far more talented in every department, his resume is all far better. Its not even close.


Vitali over Frazier?