The Top 100 Pound for Pound All-Time Greats

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by McGrain, Feb 15, 2013.


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  1. Mr Butt

    Mr Butt Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Yeah that would be best is the 100 now final
     
    Mr Butt, Feb 28, 2013
    Mr Butt, Feb 28, 2013
    #1846
  2. mattdonnellon

    mattdonnellon Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I think the Kid has more going for him than just beating Ryan, no mean feat in itself and I'd have Ryan(a great pick) just ahead of him. He beat top welter/middles in West, Creedon and Smith. From May 98 to March 99 he fought top heavies Ruhlin, Goddard, Sharkey and Choynski winning three and losing only to Sharkey. He then beat Maher to cement his position as a top Heavy. Got a bit spotty after this but over ten years later he was still beating fringe Heavyweight contenders Curran, Stewart and Savage. No way would I put OBrien ahead of the Kid, he was the Real deal!
     
    mattdonnellon, Feb 28, 2013
    mattdonnellon, Feb 28, 2013
    #1847
  3. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    I agree with you that he had a beastly run, but he doesn't quite make it for me. Likely things will look better for these guys once they have spots.
     
    McGrain, Feb 28, 2013
    McGrain, Feb 28, 2013
    #1848
  4. Boilermaker

    Boilermaker Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    While on O Brien, I really cant see any justification whatsoever for rating O Brien ahead of Tommy Burns given the way their fight went. I know Tommys case was dismissed before, but i think that he has to swap with O Brien. I agree with the McCoy push, who did more than the much better publicised Jake La motta.
     
    Boilermaker, Feb 28, 2013
    Boilermaker, Feb 28, 2013
    #1849
  5. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    I'm satisfied that LaMotta is greater than McCoy. I'm actually all but satisified that Foreman is greater than McCoy.

    Everyone can't get in guys; in this case, that means Burns and McCoy. There will be a detailed reasoning for O'Brien's inclusion shortly and i'm quite happy with it.
     
    McGrain, Feb 28, 2013
    McGrain, Feb 28, 2013
    #1850
  6. mattdonnellon

    mattdonnellon Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I'll be very interested in the O'Brien reasoning!
    PS Not a LaMotta fan either!
     
    mattdonnellon, Feb 28, 2013
    mattdonnellon, Feb 28, 2013
    #1851
  7. mattdonnellon

    mattdonnellon Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Another mattack.
    My point on Levinsky was this. I don't agree he lost his series to Dillon, first Jack had the upperhand, then Levinsky. Both fought "Greb-like" amount of quality and quantity of fights and lost the odd one here and there as you would expect. I do rate Jack ahead p4p, mainly because he was the smaller, lighter guy. I wouldn't put Levinsky in my top 100 if I had the boxing brains to compile my own and Dillon I feel belongs in the lower reaches.
    The one point I wouldn't be for turning is Mike Gibbons, he had to be in, ok the list is so strong it might be in the 80-100 stretch, but ahead of Dillon for sure.
     
    mattdonnellon, Feb 28, 2013
    mattdonnellon, Feb 28, 2013
    #1852
  8. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Mike Gibbons is ahead of Dillon.
     
    McGrain, Feb 28, 2013
    McGrain, Feb 28, 2013
    #1853
  9. mattdonnellon

    mattdonnellon Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    40 – Tommy Ryan
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    42 - Emile Griffith
    43 –Alexis Arguello
    44 – Ike Williams
    45 – Jimmy Wilde
    ----------------------------
    46 – Julio Cesar Chavez
    47 – Ruben Olivares
    48 – Fighting Harada
    49 – Carlos Ortiz
    50 – Michael Spinks
    51 – Young Corbett
    52 – Thomas Hearns
    53 - Floyd Mayweather
    54 - Manny Pacquiao
    55 – Evander Holyfield
    56 – Freddie Steele
    57 – Abe Attell
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    59 - Bernard Hopkins
    60 - Ted Kid Lewis

    I don't know, beats the **** out of me?
     
    mattdonnellon, Feb 28, 2013
    mattdonnellon, Feb 28, 2013
    #1854
  10. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    sheeeet i confused him with Tommy Ryan in my head even as i was typing him :lol:

    So if you were going to assign a number to Dillon what would it be?
     
    McGrain, Feb 28, 2013
    McGrain, Feb 28, 2013
    #1855
  11. mattdonnellon

    mattdonnellon Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    80-100 for me, damn hard to do though.
     
    mattdonnellon, Feb 28, 2013
    mattdonnellon, Feb 28, 2013
    #1856
  12. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Shiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiit man.

    Dillon:

    After losing to Klaus in May of '12, Dillon turns his career around like a motherucker. Before Levinsky beats him in 1916, he loses three fights out of about fifty. These are: a ten round newspaper decision to heavyweight Billy Miske (I respect newspaper decisions for the most part on this list btw), a ten round newspaper decision to Tom McMahon (strange one that, but he was fighting his third fight in five weeks), a career's best effort form Houck over six cost him a newspaper decision, all of which were avenged (at some point). He also beat the guys who beat him at either bookend.

    In the same time frame, he beat:
    Huge Kelly
    Jack Twin Sullivan
    George Chip x4
    Frank Mantell x3
    Battling Levinksy x4
    Frank Klaus
    Willie Brenan
    Leo Houck

    Heavyweights:
    Tom Cowler (did he make your rankings at any point btw?)
    Dan Flynn x2
    Jim Flynn x3
    Charlie Weinert x2
    Jim Savage (he make it?)
    Tom McCarty x2
    Jack Lester
    Gunboat Smith x2
    Frank Moran (!)
    Billy Miske (!)

    This is some sick on your bike crazy p4p **** right here. IN his prime he was taking out the heavyweight trash like he was 190lbs.

    Truth be told Miske, Greb, Gibbons, Levinsky, they didn't start to get to this sick ******* before he started to slip. In fact I honestly think he might need to be higher than I have him. Thanks for focusing my thoughts, but I think this is a rare occasion where one of our posts might safely be defined as way off - although I can't really talk having confused Mike Gibbons with Tommy Ryan :lol:
     
    McGrain, Feb 28, 2013
    McGrain, Feb 28, 2013
    #1857
  13. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Having looked, I don't agree with this. Dillon beat the crap out of Levinsky over and over again in his prime, and Levinsky only started to get to him once he began to slip, based on Dillon's wider results. It is confused by Levinsky being pre-prime, I guess? But in the end, i'll go with Dillon's numeric superiority.
     
    McGrain, Feb 28, 2013
    McGrain, Feb 28, 2013
    #1858
  14. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    01 – Sam Langford
    02 – Harry Greb
    03 – Sugar Ray Robinson
    04 – Henry Armstrong
    05 – Ezzard Charles
    06 – Bob Fitzsimmons
    07 – Benny Leonard
    08 – Muhammad Ali
    ---------------------------------------
    09 – Willie Pep
    10 – Joe Louis
    11 – Roberto Duran
    12 – Joe Gans
    13 – Packey McFarland
    14 – Archie Moore
    15 – Sugar Ray Leonard
    16 – Mickey Walker
    -------------------------------------------
    17 – Barney Ross
    18 – Terry McGovern
    19 – Tony Canzoneri
    20 – Pernell Whitaker
    21 – Charley Burley
    22 – Holman Williams
    23 – Jimmy McLarnin
    24 – Sandy Saddler
    -------------------------------
    25 - George Dixon
    26 - Barbados Joe Walcott
    27 - Stanley Ketchel
    28 - Billy Conn
    29 - Kid Gavilan
    30 -Roy Jones
    31- Gene Tunney
    32 - Tommy Gibbons
    33 - Tommy Loughran
    34 – Jack Britton
    -----------------------------------------
    35 – Eder Jofre
    36 – Jose Napoles
    37 – Carlos Monzon
    38 – Jimmy Bivins
    39 – Marvin Hagler
    40 – Tommy Ryan
    41 – Jack Dillon
    42 - Emile Griffith
    43 –Alexis Arguello
    44 – Ike Williams
    45 – Jimmy Wilde
    ----------------------------
    46 – Julio Cesar Chavez
    47 – Ruben Olivares
    48 – Fighting Harada
    49 – Carlos Ortiz
    50 – Michael Spinks
    51 – Young Corbett
    52 – Thomas Hearns
    53 - Floyd Mayweather
    54 - Manny Pacquiao
    55 – Evander Holyfield
    56 – Freddie Steele
    57 – Abe Attell
    58 – Mike Gibbons
    59 - Bernard Hopkins
    60 - Ted Kid Lewis
    61 - Luis Manuel Rodriguez
    62 - Salvador Sanchez
    63 - Wilfredo Gomez
    64 - Vicente Saldivar
    65 - Rocky Marciano
    -----------------------------------
    66 - Lou Ambers
    67 - Freddie Welsh
    68 - Jim Driscoll
    69 - Dick Tiger
    70 - Harold Johnson
    71 - Carmen Bassilio
    72 - Manuel Ortiz
    72 - Carlos Zarate
    74 - Miguel Canto
    75 - Jack Dempsey (np)
    -------------------------------------
    76 - Lloyd Marshall
    77 - Oscar De La Hoya
    78 - Azumah Nelson
    79 - Mike McCallum
    80 - Bob Foster
    81 - Teddy Yarosz
    82 - Pascual Perez
    83 - Panama Al Brown
    ---------------------------------------
    84 - Young Griffo
    ------------------------------
    85 – Jake LaMotta
    86 – Larry Holmes
    87 – Wilfred Benitez
    88 – Juan Manuel Marquez
    89 – Erik Morales
    90 – Marco Antonio Barrera
    91 - Fritzie Zivic
    92 - Joe Frazier
    93 - Pete Herman
    94 - Lennox Lewis
    95 - Jack "Kid" Berg
    96 - Philadelphia Jack O'Brien
    97 - James Toney
    98 - Nicolino Locche
    99 - Jung Koo Chang
    100-George Foreman


    Still happy to hear any objections or suggestions you guys.
     
    McGrain, Feb 28, 2013
    McGrain, Feb 28, 2013
    #1859
  15. the cobra

    the cobra Awesomeizationism! Full Member

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    I have no big problem with the list at all, I quite like it. I like this batch of guys as being the top 100. The one thing that does irk me a bit though is the 20 whole spots between Hagler and Hopkins, and I want to say it now so that I don't say it after he beats Cloud (hopefully) and have it just come across as post-fight hysteria.

    Its the Hearns win, I know, and that's huge and Tommy has to rate so high himself, but the overall resumes of Hags and Hops seem to be pretty much on par for me. Same goes for dominance, same goes for peak ability/skill level. It's basically the Hearns win vs Hopkins' success above 160 and much greater longevity as I see it. OK if Hagler is higher, by like, 5 spots, maybe...but 20 gets to me, man.
     
    the cobra, Feb 28, 2013
    the cobra, Feb 28, 2013
    #1860
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