The Top 100 Pound for Pound All-Time Greats

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by McGrain, Feb 15, 2013.

  1. salsanchezfan

    salsanchezfan Boxing Junkie Full Member

    Aug 22, 2004
    Still haven't seen your list, of course...….
  2. Bob Sebring

    Bob Sebring New Member Full Member

    Oct 13, 2017
    I see your point and you make good arguments for this list in supporting it; but like I mentioned a bunch of losses for several of them; and we would put them in the top ten of all-time? That has to be considered, too. I would consider George Foreman one of the biggest punchers ever; and he isn't even on the radar screen with this list; and he fought against the very best in his era. Just using this as an example, to illustrate my point further on the subject.
  3. Bob Sebring

    Bob Sebring New Member Full Member

    Oct 13, 2017
    With respect to your discourse; I was responding to the list that was being discussed on this forum; this list is so fouled up; I wouldn't want to offend others by providing my "own" list. I just pointed out small examples of other legends who in any era would dominate, irregardless, of weight class.
  4. salsanchezfan

    salsanchezfan Boxing Junkie Full Member

    Aug 22, 2004
    Actually it's a very good list. The few names you threw out expose a certain.........oh, let's call it lack of scope but no, by all means; offend away. Let's see the list.
  5. Bob Sebring

    Bob Sebring New Member Full Member

    Oct 13, 2017
    Let me ask you a question; why are you so "attached" to this list being discussed on the forum? For brevity sake, I don't have the time and patience to draft my own list, nor do I feel the need to do it, so you can criticize with no actual theoretical basis behind it. "Lack of scope" shows you know very little about my vast array of sports history and knowledge with many given sports; especially boxing....Have a terrific day.
  6. salsanchezfan

    salsanchezfan Boxing Junkie Full Member

    Aug 22, 2004
    I'm not particularly interested in the list, at least right now. I just like to call bullsh/tters on their crap is all. You fly in here completely unknown and trash a very well thought out and researched piece, and expose your own lack of knowledge in so doing.

    No one minds someone perhaps knowing a little less than others, and needing to learn. That's why we're here I guess. But the combination of lack of knowledge and conceit and high-mindedness is something no one wants to see.

    That answer your question, Slim?
  7. Bob Sebring

    Bob Sebring New Member Full Member

    Oct 13, 2017
    I agree with all of your observations, that are fundamentally sound in all respects; but I do believe at different points in his career, based on weight class, Floyd would have lost to Sugar Ray Leonard, Thomas Hearns, a trim and fit Roberto Duran, Aaron Pryor, and Alexis Arguello; to name a few who dominated multiple weight classes....
  8. salsanchezfan

    salsanchezfan Boxing Junkie Full Member

    Aug 22, 2004

    Fair enough.
  9. Gazelle Punch

    Gazelle Punch Active Member Full Member

    Aug 15, 2018
    Marciano should be ranked higher. Beat three of your top 15. But awesome list.
  10. ChrisJS

    ChrisJS Member Full Member

    Sep 11, 2018
    I had Barney Ross in there but moved it around. I’d have him at my -#21 spot and move everyone else down one.

    gave mine a shot a few years ago and have tweaked it every now and again. I don't have exact criteria and I'm sure some picks are baffling to some. These lists are subjective and we all have out biases right? I generally like to rate relative to their era and I do value technique and skill level highly and often it's my tie-breaker when I see two or more guys as being fairly equal. I do value long, dominant reigns and being undisputed or at least majority unified (more for modern day), I don't really value multi-weights unless it's multi-unified weights. I think it's important to put perspective on certain era's like unique achievements. More fighters are retiring unbeaten these days as opposed to the past so without necessarily cheapening the achievement that much it just shows that it's a little easier to navigate your career without a loss these days. A long dominant reign as the one true champion means a lot more than a long reign these days for example Archie Moore's reign is obviously better than Calzaghe's or Lopez'. It's true we tend to read too much into modern day fighters losses but it's also true that some folks tend to read too much into non-title bout losses in past era's or early and late career losses. The quality of competition in title reigns and the records there is often where the meat of a resume is but not in all cases. Like I said it's not an exact science and though some may ridicule my list or some picks if you post yours there's stuff I and others will also tear down.

    Some of the fighters I know a lot more than others and obviously we have a tendency to scrutinize certain fighters more. The less footage on a guy we can either go too overboard on how good he was or too much the other way if he lost or looked bad. I tend to respect what was written in the history books and by historians and eye witnesses and see how they talked about the fighters compared to one's that came before and after.

    1. Sugar Ray Robinson
    2. Harry Greb
    3. Henry Armstrong
    4. Willie Pep
    5. Sam Langford
    6. Roberto Duran
    7. Ezzard Charles
    8. Eder Jofre
    9. Benny Leonard
    10. Carlos Monzon
    11. Gene Tunney
    12. Mickey Walker
    13. Muhammad Ali
    14. Tony Canzoneri
    15. Joe Louis
    16. Sugar Ray Leonard
    17. Archie Moore
    18. Carlos Ortiz
    19. Jimmy Wilde
    20. Joe Gans
    21. Jimmy McLarnin
    22. Sandy Saddler
    23. Kid Gavilan
    24. Ike Williams
    25. Bob Fitzsimmons
    26. Marvelous Marvin Hagler
    27. Pernell Whitaker
    28. Packey McFarland
    29. Charles Burley
    30. Tommy Loughran
    31. Jose Napoles
    32. Alexis Arguello
    33. Tommy Hearns
    34. Roy Jones
    35. Billy Conn
    36. Julio Cesar Chavez
    37. Evander Holyfield
    38. Floyd Mayweather
    39. Ruben Olivares
    40. Manny Pacquaio
    41. Emile Griffith
    42. **** Tiger
    43. Joe Walcott (the original)
    44. Terry McGovern
    45. Michael Spinks
    46. Jack Johnson
    47. Fighting Harada
    48. Jack Britton
    49. Ted "Kid" Lewis
    50. Bernard Hopkins
    51. Tommy Ryan
    52. Kid Chocolate
    53. Juan Manuel Marquez
    54. Holman Wiliams
    55. Salvador Sanchez
    56. George Dixon
    57. Pancho Villa
    58. Lou Ambers
    59. Tiger Flowers
    60. Rocky Marciano
    61. Wilfredo Gomez
    62. Larry Holmes
    63. Jack Dempsey (Nonpareil)
    64. Bob Montgomery
    65. Beau Jack
    66. Marcel Cerdan
    67. Jake LaMotta
    68. Joe Brown
    69. Charles McCoy
    70. Abe Attell
    71. Luis Rodriguez
    72. Jimmy Bivins
    73. Lloyd Marshall
    74. Mike McCallum
    75. Azumah Nelson
    76. Philadelphia Jack O'Brien
    77. Mike Gibbons
    78. Fidel La Barba
    79. Battling Battalino
    80. Felix Trinidad
    81. Jim Driscoll
    82. Jack "Kid" Berg
    83. Wilfred Benitez
    84. Carlos Zarate
    85. Joe Calzaghe
    86. Freddie Steele
    87. Johnny Dundee
    88. Freddie Welsh
    89. Marco Antonio Barrera
    90. Erik Morales
    91. Panama Al Brown
    92. Ricardo Lopez
    93. Gene Fullmer
    94. Vicente Saldivar
    95. Lennox Lewis
    96. Manuel Ortiz
    97. Nino Benvenutti
    98. Harold Johnson
    99. Maxie Rosenbloom
    100. James Toney

    Honorable mentions that almost don't feel right placing outside the top 100 - George Foreman, Joe Frazier, Jack Dempsey, Pete Herman, Ad Wolgast, Benny Lynch, Eusebio Pedroza, Miguel Canto, Young Corbett III, Sammy Angott, Jack Delaney, Aaron Pryor, Joey Giardello, Tony Zale, Jack Dillon, Carmen Basilio, Pascual Perez, Niccolino Locche and many others I'm sure.
    Last edited: Oct 31, 2018
  11. Flea Man

    Flea Man มวยสากล Full Member

    Sep 7, 2008
    Some of the posts in here since the heyday of this thread are.....well, quite frankly abysmal.
  12. Jamzy ⭐

    Jamzy ⭐ Member Full Member

    Oct 8, 2018
    Strange that no one has Charles Martin or Tony Bellew in there top 100.
    mcvey likes this.
  13. Westwind7

    Westwind7 New Member Full Member

    Jul 26, 2018
    I'd find room for Benny Lynch and Joey Archer in that top 100. Outside of Jimmy Wilde, Lynch could beat any other flyweight. Archer with his silky skills could have given quite a few in that top 100 a boxing lesson
  14. Doppleganger

    Doppleganger Il Genio Full Member

    Dec 30, 2005
    I have a problem with this. It's not useful to lump together the entire lineage of a sport then determine the best of all time, other than for ****s or giggles. This ignores the evolution (or devolution in some cases) of a sport over time. As sports grow and develop they change, rules are refined, standards are generally improved, goalposts are changed. If the sport becomes more popular then the overal level of competition increases, which in itself usually raises the bar.

    For example, there's just no way to say with any real conviction that Bob Fitzsimmons or Sam Langford are 'likely the two biggest punchers ever.' It's just an opinion and I could counter by saying that Jackson or Hearns are bigger punchers P4P. Who is right? They fought in different eras with different rulesets and mentalities. I think it's better to say that all 4 are among the hardest punchers P4P of all time. It's like in football - can you really say who was better between Pele, Maradona or Messi? I can't and I would argue that no-one really can. it's all just opinions at the end of the day.
  15. Rumsfeld

    Rumsfeld Moderator Staff Member

    Jul 19, 2004
    Was just perusing through McGrain's top 100 heavyweights, broken down into 10 chapters. Good stuff McGrain.

    McGrain likes this.

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