The Underrated/Overrated thread

Let me guess, it went a little something like this:

"Ali vs Marciano. Ali lost 5 times, Marciano lost none. I don't think it takes a genius to figure this one out."

Or some kind of backwards ass logic like that.

 

Underrated: Kostya Tzsyu

Overrated: Naseem Hamed

 

Pryor was a slight favourite but many mags picked Pryor due to his unorthodoxy being potentially troublesome and Arguello being thought to have risen one division too many. Arguello was fave because Pryor wasn't yet clearly proven and was not immune to hitting the canvas and some pondered whether he could handle Alexis' power.

 

Your original statement was this

Hundreds of clubfighters have taken this and much much more. A great chin doesn't = impossible to overrate.

I'd give pre Chavez Taylor a chance, Buddy McGirt would be interesting, Napoles barring cuts would win IMO, Duran would decimate him IMO etc. As for Leonard, i have it on hard paper the fight was signed for after a SRL - Stafford match before the retina. Pryor was made for Leonard, slower, less power, looser and smaller. Pryor lacked Duran's power and intrinsic skill to ever surprise Leonard. Pryor simply has nothing to win with there.

 

It always tickles me pink that people think a SRL was scared of a Pryor because he beat an aging ex Featherweight with about 80 fights behind him over 14 rounds. The much smaller Arguello took his punches for ages, imagine what little affect they would have a division up vs a natural 147 with a great chin. It would have been great action while it lasted, but the Hawk would have been shot down mid rounds at the latest.

 

Underrated: Jose Napoles

Overrated: Zab Judah

 

Overrated: Mayweather Jr - some people have this guy in top 15 of all time, despite not clearing out the strongest division in the sport today.

 

Respectfully McGrain, I don't think anybody ever overrated Joey Maxim. He's always been fairly appraised by most everyone on the basis of his efforts. Against Robinson, for example, virtually no credit is ever given to Maxim at all for his withstanding the same heat, in the same ring, on the same night as Robinson. True, he was behind in the scoring, and his efforts offensively were minimal, but in SOME way shape or form, he HAD to be doing something effectively to be able to deal with Robinson, and the heat that night. I've read that, it may have been Maxim's strategy to conserve his strength as much as possible, and let Robinson do all the exerting, so that the heat would wear him out, and if that were so that "it was a diabolically successful strategy on Maxim's part". He lost three times to Moore, and had onlt a modest few defenses of the lightheavy title, while at the same time, in over 200 fights (I think that's how many) he was only stopped very early in his career, and that to a murderous punching Curtis Shepard, whom he defeated very soon afterwards by decision to avenge that defeat. Maxim performed very well within his limitations, after all, he was a lightpunching, defensive type boxer, who was to some, overly cautious and primarily a counterpuncher. He was never a particularly thrilling fighter, and had a safety first type of ring philosophy, but to me, there's nothing wrong about that. Most people even dispute his late career victory over Floyd Patterson, giving him no credit for that one either. So how in the world can he be overrated? If anything, he deserved credit for campaigning so long against the top guys with, like I say, a rather limited style, as good as it was.

 

:good good point

 

Pryor was a great fighter at his weight but I think would fall short vs SSL

 

because most fans like the shoeshine (flash and Brash) as opposed to Quiet power and strength

 

Yes, for sure Ken Buchanan was seriously underrated. He had the same misfortune that Rodrigo Valdez had, and that's to be unfortunately in the same era as an alltime great. It just isn't fair, it seems, but if it weren't for Duran and Monzon, then Buchanan and Valdez would be considered the greatest of their time. In considering Ken Buchanan, one of my personal favorites, he was a phantom-like boxer in his prime with the extra added edge of toughness and competitive attitude, like when he met Ismael Laguna in his own backyard (well almost, in Puerto Rico) and outgutted him for the title, then did the same, after having his eye damaged in the rematch. Buchanan was a brilliant boxer, who put on quite a show against undefeated Canadian Donato Paduano in 1970 on the undercard of Ali-Bonavena. This performance dazzled even the old timers like Nat Fliescher and some of his old cronies of the old staff of Ring Magazine. It was an artistic performance in which he toally befuddled and outclassed Paduano. I wish there was a tape of the fight, as I'd love to see it. I think he gave Duran his toughest challenge and deserved the rematch.

 

I agree that Buchannan is grossly underrated...I would say the same of Laguna who I had ahead on the scorecard of the first fight...but Buchanan dominated (maybe not but easily controlled) the action of the sequal! I would put both in the underrated category!

 

Cobra,

There is footage of Buchanan/Paduano in circulation as I have the fight, you could track down a copy rather easily I would think. As for my vote as to who is under/overrated, that would depend on the criteria... do the fighters have to be retired or could we include current fighters in this disscussion as well? I`ll wait before giving my picks until someone clears this up for me.

 

I can't speak for everyone, but I limited my picks to fighters who were retired, simply because you can't truly assess a fighter's place in history, for the most part, until his career's been completed.