The vertical punch

alright, we have pretty much the same views then. hard styles of karate are fantastic for fighting IMO. the only downside to karate and traditional MA's is it takes a lot of effort to get anything useful out of them. I'm confident in my abilities though and could readily school anyone if i went back there to spar.

 

Actually if you find old Jack Dempsey training he teaches you how to punch verticle fist. It has advantages and disadvantages. Advantages your wrist is straight so you are less likely to injure your wrist and you can get an extra .5" reach, but a disadvantage is that you are punching with your two smallest knuckles and run a greater chance of breaking your smaller knuckles because they can't absorb as much force.

 

I can't remember, but I think Bruce Lee acknowledged Jack Dempsey as the source for some of his punches...

 

I though you meant that boxers didn't use vertical punches.There is an component of vertical punching in hooks and uppercuts.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=M9msELiZKyU
Maybe horizontal punches are not as effective in a MMA context.Generally,though,boxers don't throw pure vertical punches.

I think the reason why is because why is when you fully extend the vertical fist you engage the supraspinatus muscles in your shoulder,which sort of pull back your arm.

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Here's a horizontal punch for comparison...

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If you punch correctly on the verticle fist (at least the way I was tought it perfectly aligns with the bottom three knuckles. If you don't believe it put your fist vertically on the wall. Also twist your fist after you do. The difference is really small but there is a difference. Old style boxers used to not twist the jab or cross. Also if you look into other martial arts there is one where the uppercut does not have all knuckles facing you. A guy name Eric Paulson said that in one of his Training DVD seminars. Dempsey taught that the only difference between boxing and real fist fightin is anger.

 

I'm not sure who he is but I know Bruce Lee aknowledges both Dempsey and Marciano and has taken things from them for his self defense system. Of course the verticle punch probably came from his wing chun training.
The twisting punch came from karate and Tae Kwon Do.

 

True. WingChun's mainstay is the vertical punch because it is used for quick repeated punching. It isnt a lock-in punch like the cross that is used in Karate. I think part of the reason Lee stuck with the vertical is also due to the JKD stance of the lead hand being placed in the center of his body (opposed to boxing where it is held to the side normally). That means the vertical punch being exceuted from the center emanates into a semi-backhand punch. (Lee also poked with his lead back-hand so they were interchangable). Given that, a boxer holds his hand to the side of his chin or shoulder and naturally will turn his shoulder into his lead jab, making a twist punch more natural in the jab.
I only find that the twist has more lock but not as much flicker as the vertical.

 

I'm not sure if other people have already mentioned this, but the reason the orthodox way of punching is to turn your hand over at the end of the punch is that the mechanics of it means that it generates more power. A few punches here and there with the vertical hand is ok to mix things up but if that was your standard way of punching, in boxing terms that would be considered a fairly serious technical flaw.