The WBA Elimination Tournament

Particularly as infamously the BBB of C refused to let their fighters fight for a WBA crown until Frank ****** almost brought them down in the early 80s.

I was under the impression Cooper was offered a place, but the BBB of C refused to let him take the spot, thus Sir 'enry gave back his British title in protest.

 

I think because Joe frazier already was #1 with the WBA and in line for a shot as mandatory chalenger yank Durham obviously thought it was a bit of a liberty to expect frazier to take on seven men he had climbed over to gain a position as #2 or #1 in a final. Frazier was mandatory chalenger, he did not need to re earn his position. Joe had already beat bonavena who was in the tournement and had that big KO win over chuvalo.

I think the chuvalo v corletti fight was in London and the British some how wanted something to come of it since Cooper refused to defend his empire title against Chuvalo yet the loss got chuvalo a world title fight with Ali. Corletti had good wins in England. He beat Billy walker and Johnny Prescott. He must have been based in the UK because he was billed as being from England when he was knocked out by Al blue Lewis.

We will never know if Martin was any better than corletti and Ramos appeared to be in 1967. They certainly had better resumes at that time than Martin.

 

No I think that was after Ellis won the thing Dundee wanted a safe defence in Europe for Jimmy before a Frazier showdown. Cooper accepted the fight after giving up his belt in protest but injured himself so Dundee took Patterson in Sweden for Jimmy's "safe defence" and Ellis almost blew it!

 

What's puzzling me is what Ellis had done to gain inclusion?

 

Ellis made a big splash at just the right time beating Johnny persol in one round on the Ali vs Folley card. Persol was rated #9 heavyweight on account of his own win over rated contender Amos big train Lincoln.

 

Lots of bull**** flying around this thread. For instance the guy who thinks Liston would be a favorite in the tournament and would have loved to have seen him batter Quarry... Well, Quarry's people chased a Liston fight and Liston wanted none of it.

For those denigrating Frazier's choice of opposition after winning his portion of the title you need to remember that Ellis was ducking him so blatantly it was ridiculous. After Ellis won his portion Angelo Dundee gleefully admitted they werent going anywhere near Frazier (they knew Frazier would kick the living **** out of Ellis). You can criticize Frazier but during that same time Ellis had exactly one fight, a gift decision win over aged first round tournament loser Patterson. There just werent a whole lot of options for Frazier because the tournament had canablized so many of the top ten contenders, if he was going to defend it was going to have to be against someone that was in the tournament (Bonavena and Quarry) or someone that was just on the fringe (Ramos and Chuvalo). And frankly all of those fights were artistic successes as far as Im concerned and all of them were every bit as interesting as Ellis' bout with Patterson, moreso IMO.

As for the guy asking if Bonavena was any better than Chuvalo... Well, yes. He dropped Chuvalo twice and beat him and when both fought Frazier Chuvalo was blasted out in four rounds while Bonavena went 10 (dropping Frazier twice) and 15 respectively.

Also, Frazier was absolutely the number 1 contender when the tournament was being arranged. Its why he refused to be part of it. He felt he had fought his way to the #1 position and he shouldnt have to fight three fights for the championship on equal standing with a bunch of guys who were rated below him. For refusing to enter the tournament he was dropped in the ratings to make room for one of the other contenders.

 

Agreed. Ali deserves some credit for fighting Quarry and Bonavena on his return, they were as good as any out there bar Joe and maybe Ellis.

 

Cooper was offered a fight against the WBA Champion Jimmy Ellis he accepted ,but the BBOC refused to recognize it as a title fight,as they were affiliated with the WBC.So he resigned his title.

 

Chuvalo only got the title shot as a late replacement for Terrell, he had 17 days of training for the fight. His result against Corletti had nothing to do with it.
Neither Walker ,or Prescott meant anyrthing at world level.
I think Corletti was based in Italy.

 

Exactly how I described it. The WBA were in the wrong dropping Frazier. He was their #1 and they wanted him to prove himself all over again!! The tournament should have been what the NYBC wanted it to be. A tournament designed to find a contender to meet Frazier for the vacent title.

When Marciano retired Moore was the outstanding contender. He was not asked to face people he climbed over. Baker, valdes (who moore already beat) were next in line and the winner of them met Jackson who Patterson beat to challenge Moore in a vacant title fight. It was the correct way to do it.

 

I realise that but wether Prescott and Walker meant anything the upshot is corletti also beat chuvalo who got Ali in his next fight. and chuvalo was a good value chalenger. Corletti beat chuvalo and he got nothing. All I can think is there must be a reason why the BBB of C pushed for Colletti. Maybe they just thought this Italian Argentine heavyweight keeps winning over here and his resume is better than Leotis Martin who just got an invite into the elimination group?

 

Arthur Mercante the referee scored their fight a draw, that good enough for me. The highlights showed there was not much in it. And so it proved. Mercante is consistent as a judge. Both fought Ali and Frazier. One did better with Frazier the other did better with Al. All the same to me.

 

His last 5 fights were 4, 1 round kos and a pts win over Billy Daniels.
Not exceptional but none of the men in the tourney were standouts,indeed Terrell was expected to win it.

 

Did you agree with Frazier facing unranked Mathis for the NY version of the world title?

 

This was seen as a grudge match from the amateur days. Mathis was a "good" opponent in the sense that he was undefeated, different-definitely-and actually a good boxer untainted by defeat in the WBA tourney.
He went on to give Joe a good fight, Mercante had them level at the point of stoppage and he did go on to school Chuvalo. The Frazier fight was the coming out of a prospect.