the what fights did you watch today\scorecard thread.

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Mantequilla, Nov 20, 2009.


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  1. frankenfrank

    frankenfrank Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    David Haye vs Nicolay Valuev

    I doubt that it was a real fight.
    Neither man seemed to try.
    Lots of feinting in the 1st 1/2 of ze fight.
    Lots of sensible retreating by Haye during ze whole fight.
    Made Valuev chicken dance in rd 12.
    Haye did take a good jab 2d face in it 2.


    Tyson vs Berbick (4th / 5th or 6th watch) :
    In real time speed it was hard 2 notice any elbows, but in slow mo and probably a different angle 2 it was very clear that Tyson blatantly elbowed him and more than once.
    Back when I watched it on ESPN it was even clearer in their real time.
    Different angles I assume.
     
    frankenfrank, Mar 7, 2015
    frankenfrank, Mar 7, 2015
    #4006
  2. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    :rofl absolutely awesome.
     
    McGrain, Mar 7, 2015
    McGrain, Mar 7, 2015
    #4007
  3. The_Hawk_2

    The_Hawk_2 Lineal WW Champion Full Member

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    SRL vs Hagler

    Just watched it to see if Hagler was actually robbed.

    Here's how I scored it

    Leonard: 1,2,4,8,9,11,12
    Hagler: 3,6,7,10
    Even: 5
    116-113 for Leonard

    I thought Leonard pretty convincingly. Hagler missed ALOT during the fight and Leonard simply landed the cleaner punches. I could've done without the holding but it was still a solid performance from Leonard considering he'd been gone for 5 years.
     
    The_Hawk_2, Mar 9, 2015
    The_Hawk_2, Mar 9, 2015
    #4008
  4. frankenfrank

    frankenfrank Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Tyson vs Spinks

    Yes, Tyson did elbow him.
    Spinks seemed thicker than usual, probably fatter.
    His personal record in thickness and an accumulation of damages in his knees hampered his mobility and helped to finish him quicker.


    Tyson vs Mathis Jr.

    Mathis Jr. did surprisingly well until getting floored.
    An even fight up to that point.
     
    frankenfrank, Mar 10, 2015
    frankenfrank, Mar 10, 2015
    #4009
  5. red cobra

    red cobra Loyal Member Full Member

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    :goodGreat rundown r by r of the fight McGrain. Being a huge Galindez fan, I watched it live back then of course...thought (in my impartial way) that Galindez barely nicked it, even without the kd and the points deduction, but only barely.
     
    red cobra, Mar 12, 2015
    red cobra, Mar 12, 2015
    #4010
  6. red cobra

    red cobra Loyal Member Full Member

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    According to Pastrano himself, in Peter Heller's "In This Corner", this was precisely Willie's basic strategy. He though that HJ was a "beast" and just ate up guys that came to him...that went after him, so he devised a plan where e would retreat constantly, forcing Johnson out of his comfort zone...making him be the aggressor and have to go after Willie. WP based this on the belief that you could beat the champion and win the title by making the other guy come to you. Whether he did or not is hotly debated, but that was a career best, ultra-sleek performance by Willie Pastrano and it's easy to see how he influenced Cassius Clay with his style....especiallyu his footwork. Inefficient, energy consuming? Maybe, but Pastrano COULD do it, when in shape, and ALL NIGHT LONG, like Ali, pre-exile, so why not?
     
    red cobra, Mar 12, 2015
    red cobra, Mar 12, 2015
    #4011
  7. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    :good
     
    McGrain, Mar 12, 2015
    McGrain, Mar 12, 2015
    #4012
  8. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Mar 21, 2007
    BERNARD HOPKINS UD12 ANTONIO TARVER

    Man, Hopkins looked great in this fight, didn't he? Faster outside, stronger inside, although he's older and smaller, and he's just in great shape. I remember watching it live, because he looks smaller, and because in the first he had to take an absolute sh!tload of steps to keep ahead of his man - "he'll gas" I thought. But he didn't gas.

    He won the first with a sneak right hand to the body, a straight right, a little uppercut, a defence splitting jab. Tarver never landed a jab. Tarver's left visited only his shoulder.

    He was criticised in this fight for falling in behind the right, but if you're the stronger man, that's good strategy. Plus, this is a fight where Hopkins does it properly, throwing punches inside, little sneak uppercut, nasty little bodyshots. More than that, the fall in becomes part feint, because when Tarver sees it he expects the right. Of course, being Hopkins, he starts landing sneak left hooks to the body as he travels, the horrible bas.

    I love the way he creeps in like a mad cat, but he's surprisingly improvisational at times, like the cross body right hook he throws in the last minute of round three.

    Buddy McGirt to Tarver after that round: "You're dancing to his beat!" But there is no other beat. After six I have it 6-0 with an additional point for the flash knockdown in the fifth. It's part mugging, part masterclass. Yes it is, lora.

    The eighth is the first contested round since the fourth, but I still scored it for Hopkins. He has Tarver knotted into feints, in fear of the right hand, which by turn is allowing him to score with the left. I was all ready to give Tarver the ninth, but Hopkins absurdly drove him back in the final seconds of the round landing a left hook, a right hand, and another left hook. Crazy stuff. In many ways this is the best performance Hopkins Mark II could possibly muster.

    Right hand leads in the tenth. Tarver can't be bothered any more.

    Eleventh is an embarrassing bullying.

    Twelve, Tarver just wants to go home.

    There are only two rounds you could reasonably score for Hopkins, 4 and 8 and you can very reasonably score them for Hopkins too.

    Twelve-zip. 120-107

    TARVER:
    HOPKINS:1,2,3,4,5*,6,7,8,9,10,11,12.

    *Hopkins drops Tarver with a counter-right.
     
    McGrain, Mar 12, 2015
    McGrain, Mar 12, 2015
    #4013
  9. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    MAURO MINA SD10 HENRY HANK

    Henry Hank is a ***** of a welcome wagon for anyone, and the rolled him out when Mauro Mina hauled out of Peru and into the United States.

    Man, Hank was a beast. I do think the beasts of yesteryear were a better brand. Guys like Hurricane Carter and Henry Hank, they were supposed thugs but they had skill, good headmovement, good footwor. These days limited beasts just look like canon-fodder.

    Hank gets off to a great start as Mina tries to move and jab. It's only when he comes down off his toes, Mina actually manages to win a round, fighting fire with fire, dangerous against Hank. Still, after four I have him 3-1 down, despite a beautiful counter-uppercut at the end of the fourth.

    The fifth feels crucial and Mina is its equal, driving fowards, out-fighting Hank on the inside with short hard punches, his head pressed to Hank's. This aggression ties the fight up after six, it's impressive the way Mina has morphed from a good stick-mover into a world class boxing volume puncher. Good depth to his stylings.

    I have them equal again after 8, Hank finally stopping Mina's run othe scorecards. Mina is a bit beast-like himself, strong, sickening puncher, great jaw, huge capacity for work and a truly excellent infighter.

    Mina jabs his way to the ninth which was fascinating to see as he has been neglecting his jab up until this point. In the tenth, they have their first clinch and Mina returns to what brought him most of the middle rounds - a pressure attack with high quality punching against a tired opponent. Mina looks much the bigger man in this final round. I thought he shaved the fight 6-4.

    HANK:1,2,4,8,
    MINA:3,5,6,7,9,

    6-4 MINA
     
    McGrain, Mar 12, 2015
    McGrain, Mar 12, 2015
    #4014
  10. bladerunner

    bladerunner El Intocable Full Member

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    Hank was robbed(common thing).

    Mina clearly lost that fight but the Cj Ross and Eugenia Williams of that time gave it to Mina.
     
    bladerunner, Mar 13, 2015
    bladerunner, Mar 13, 2015
    #4015
  11. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Definitely not a robbery by my eye. I thought Hank sleepwalked his way through the second half of that fight. UPI scored for Mina, too.

    Hank didn't dispute it either: "He's too strong. He'll beat anyone in this division he fights."
     
    McGrain, Mar 13, 2015
    McGrain, Mar 13, 2015
    #4016
  12. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    HENRY MASKE UD12 GRACIANO ROCCHIGIANI II

    It's the right hand that puts Graciano into the lead this time, that's interesting, I wonder what's happened there then? I can't see why the change. The uppercuts are still a problem. Maske obviously feels more of the same should get him home. He finds himself in desperate need of round three again though.

    After six I have them all tied, but Maske's problems by my eye are twofold. First, he's working much harder for his rounds than Rocky is for his. Second, he's winning his rounds close whereas Rocky is taking his wide with aggression and pressure. I expected Maske to look a little better here, Rocky seems less disciplined with his guard than the first fight, there are opportunities for success there.

    I think Maske should have had a point deducted in the eighth for various infringements in the seventh and eighth. I also don't like the way he speaks back to the referee. There's a sense of entitlement there IMO. Things being what they are, it's all square after eight. The fight is boring by virtue of the fact that it's a carbon copy of the last one - it feels like i've already seen it.

    Maske finally manages to push Rocky back in the ninth, though he's also clinching a bit more - I do think Rocky is themore tired of the two though. The tenth is ludicrous. Rocky tries to take it off but Maske does literally nothing so Rocky finds himself filling air with punches. Maske lands probably the best punch of the round but really - nothing is doing. It's impossible to score this round. I hate giving even frames in ten points must, because it just doesn't happen in the real, so i'll score it to Rocky on aggression. This means one of them needs 11 and 12 both to actually win.

    Maske did it. Rocky threw the eleventh and then just about got out-hit in the twelfth. Thank God there was no third fight. I found the first one absorbing, but this one didn't have the originality or the fun finish.

    MASKE:3,5,6,8,9,11,12
    ROCCHIGIANI:1,2,4,7,10


    7-5 MASKE

    117-111, 116-112, 115-113 on the official cards. Judge Richard Viliani was presumably allowed to smoke premium crack throughout.
     
    McGrain, Mar 13, 2015
    McGrain, Mar 13, 2015
    #4017
  13. zadfrak

    zadfrak Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Man, that rocchigiani is going to be one of those guys that just doesn't stand the test of time well. Like 15 years from now some up and comer in a fantasy bout & Rocky's name comes up. Kind of like one of those types that goes thru box record ****ysis as opposed to watching lots of his fights.

    But he was a tough nights work. And Maske had a tough style in there as well. I'm still shocked the way we see so many hometown decisions in the sport--follow the money mantra always holds true--and Henry was not given a draw or close nod in the Hill fight. Man, how many close nods was Hill the beneficiary of in his backyard?

    Oh yeah, a comment on that Hopkins--Tarver fight.


    I've never been sold on Tarver. But I sure wasn't thinking he was the ideal opponent for Bernard to fight at 175 either. far more like a guy to avoid.

    But that Hopkins sure is smart in his pre-fight preperations. Larry Holmes smart. He can watch guy's and instantly figure out things he can exploit and weaknesses he can capitalize on. And equally important, execute them. Some guys seem to plan things but cannot execute. Bernard Hopkins sure does.

    But that fight was a classic example of defeating a guy with intellect. Boxing smarts. It was like a tenured professor against a student showing up for college in day 1 in a debate class.

    I'm not sure what pre-fight preperations Tarver made. Or if he can adapt during a fight. He sure didn't have that skill against Hopkins. Bernard made him look like a fighter on railroad tracks, didn't he? just great. Distance. How to control distance. And how to take away and subtract distance and/or the comfort zone of an opponent.

    I thought he made Tarver think for 180 seconds of every round. Manny Steward used to talk about that and how it tires out fighters. And certain guys just don't handle that constant thinking as opposed to say blocking a right hand.
     
    zadfrak, Mar 16, 2015
    zadfrak, Mar 16, 2015
    #4018
  14. red cobra

    red cobra Loyal Member Full Member

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    Frankie Randall-Julio Cesar Chavez l

    An amazing performance by Frankie Randall...almost Buster Douglas like. He dominated Chavez IMO...he had an answer for everything Chavez did. To me, he looked to take damn near every round in a truly great, inspired performance..and although JCC made some rounds closer than others, I can't think of one round that he clearly took...but I give him the benefit of a doubt, as I was watching a video, and not actually there to see the live fight at ringside. Randall scored with relative light punches at first, but gradually, as he gained confidence, he increased the intensity of the shot...stinging blows that confused Chavez and made him honest. The two low blows that Chavez was penalized for were for real and a part of some nefarious scheme by referee Richard Steele to take his title away. The low blows, to Randall's credit, only seemed to spur him on as he went at Julio fearlessly, with purpose and a vengeance.
    The knockdown in round 11 was the cherry atop the frosting on the cake as far as I'm concerned, unlike the opinion of the perpetually sore loser Julio Cesar Chavez.
    It was a thing of beauty...a straight right snaking between Julio's guard.
    Again, Randall's fearless, seizing of the moment reminded me of a night in Tokyo in 1990...an epic, once in a career rise to greatness by Frankie Randall. The beauty of this fight was only marred by the atrociousneess of the scoring by the Mexican judge....in favor, unbelieveably, for Chavez....making it a bull**** farce of a split decision. If Randall didn't win by a shutout, then it was damned near a shutout.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VnmX15s7c4w
     
    red cobra, Mar 16, 2015
    red cobra, Mar 16, 2015
    #4019
  15. zadfrak

    zadfrak Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Yep. Scoring out that Holyfield/Lewis #1 DKP stuff. Man, when his moneymaker is in a decision bout, a guy has to pretty much dominate 9 rounds to squeek out a decision. the absolute worst of all the hometown decisions are/were those DKP bouts.

    and that's why so many cross promotion bouts never materialized. nobody wanted to put their guy in with a King fighter.

    Great boxing by 15-1 dog Randall. He did what he always did and Chavez could never solve the guy. The guy getting solved was Julio Chavez. going in, i thought this was the first time in a long time chavez was facing a guy without a sloppy defense and a guy that could hold his hands up an entire fight. He was facing guys giving those automatic openings and this opponent did nothing of the sort. Took him to school & here was Chavez with like 3x as many fights.
     
    zadfrak, Mar 16, 2015
    zadfrak, Mar 16, 2015
    #4020
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