the what fights did you watch today\scorecard thread.

Fight 59: Saldivar vs Laguna

1: 10-9
2: 10-9
3: 10-9
4: 10-9
5: 10-9
6: 9-10
7: 9-10
8: 9-10
9: 9-10
10: 10-9

96- 94

This fight was no robbery, but it was a fight with 10 swing rounds imo.

The fight was fought at such a high level it was very difficult discerning a victor after every 3 minute stanza.

The story of the fight was two top contenders facing each other (remember when that used to actually happen?) Laguna was the slick quick rangy fighter, Saldivar was the shorter fighter who preferred to his work on the inside.

Saldivar, for me, had the far superior jab and better footwork, Laguna had more fluid punches. If Laguna threw a 1-2, it landed and Saldivar would have to reset, not sure why he didn't do it more.

Saldivar would often jab his way in, sidestep the hooks and uppercuts and then outfight Laguna on the inside.

Limited clinching meant there was high level infighting and Laguna could certainly hold his own.

Extremely close fight and I'm not sure there were any clear rounds at all.

Looking at the FW scene today with Frampton, LSC, Mares and GRJ, Saldivar would clean house as he did in his own era.

 

MARCO ANTONIO BARRERA 115 | 113 ERIL MORALES II

 

MARCO ANTONIO BARRERA 117 | 111 JOHNNY TAPIA

 

Luf, I scored this as well a few months back. This is what I wrote at the time. We disagreed on rounds 1, 4 and 7 and I had the 3rd round even. But this is all understandable due to the closeness of this fight. Everyone should take pen in hand and score this one. A real good one.


Round 1: Laguna
Round 2: Saldivar
Round 3: Even
Round 4: Laguna
Round 5: Saldivar
Round 6: Laguna
Round 7: Saldivar
Round 8: Laguna
Round 9: Laguna
Round 10: Saldivar

Total: 5-4-1 Laguna

Believe me, no robbery. This was damn close. It was Ali-Frazier stuff. Saldivar chasing down the elegant Laguna and when he did get inside he let it rip. However, Saldivar had to eat so much leather to get inside. It was so tight that I cannot dispute the UPI report, who had it 5-4-1 Saldivar. So many rounds were close they could have been scored even or for the other fighter. No robbery here. And I would suggest you all watch this for an enjoyable fight. Man, it was over before I knew it, which is how fast it played out

 

As I said mate, pretty much every round is a swing round. A strange one when the shorter man has the better jab but the rangier man has the more fluid combination punching.

 

Fight 60: Ortiz vs Castillo

Only highlights of the third fight exist. Manuel Ortiz is a brutishly strong BW. Reminds me a bit of Margarito but better defensively and much quicker hands.

Seeing him with his head on the chest of Castillo was quite amusing and seeing him exhale hooks up close was baffling to some degree. Obviously he has faith in his conditioning and workrate and he did eventually grind Castillo down but no without taking a good deal of leather.

It would take something special to beat a fully motivated Ortiz as he basically fights in top gear for the full fight. If you have a good enough beard and are willing to mix it up in close you might be able to sway the judges, but other than that it takes an extreme athlete to stay away from him.

I can imagine him today having wars with Yamanaka, LSC, Agbeko, Mares, Darchinyan and I'm not sure any of those would realistically be expected to come out on top of such a battle.

 

Fight 61: Jofre v Harada 1

1: 9-10
2: 9-10
3: 9-10
4: 9-10
5: 10-9
6: 9-10
7: 9-10
8: 10-9
9: 10-9
10: 9-10
11: 10-9
12: 9-10
13: 10-9
14: 10-9
15: 10-9

I have Harada winning by 1 round. I think it's a stretch scoring the fight for jofre, but admittedly a lot of the rounds are close.

It seems to me that whenever Harada opened up and unleashed his blizzard of punches, he had too much for Jofre. The times when the pace slowed, Jofre happily dictated the action.

His strategy in the first half fof the fight worked brilliantly (aside from the arse kicking he took in round 5 when jofre finally comanded his respect) and maybe too brilliantly. If he toned the volume down a notch he'd probably have still outpumnched Jofre but also left more in the tank for the second half of the fight for him to maintain that pace.

 

Fight 62: Moore vs Johnson

Only highlights exist of this one.

How awesome is the jab of Harold Johnson?

Moore says he always had faith in the come from behind ko but I don't buy it. I think he knew punch for punch he couldn't match the skill and speed of Johnson but I also think he had a better understanding of the 15 round game.

The highlights show Moore slowing Johnson down and ultimately catching him and you can see the defensive nowse of Moore and the quick counters but it also shows his limitations round wise whilst also highlighting how dangerous he is.

Great performance against probably the best opponent he ever beat.

 

Really enjoying these reports Luf......

 

Cheers man.

 

Fight 63: Tunney vs Dempsey.

Technically I think it's highlights that exist of this fight as it didn't seem to be a full 3 minutes for every round, it wasn't far off though.

How modern a performance is this by Tunney though. Jab and movement then any time Jack closes the distance he holds him.

It's the style I like least but it's clearly very effective.

I don't buy into all the furore about the long count. What I do accept is in Dempsey's prime he'd have been able to stand over Gene and most likely finished him for a ko victory.

Clearly Tunney would always trouble Jack, he was just as strong as him and had a better jab, his deficiencies up close he solved with a clinch which shows his awareness as he's usually the better man inside, obviously not against a two fisted puncher like Jack though.

I can't help but think a prime Jack with that extra bit if speed gets to him earlier and isn't so easily nullified but that doesn't take away from how dominant a performance this is.

And for those who bang on about the evolution of the sport, this fight is no different to Ward v Kovalev really. The ko artist is a bit past his prime and is reduced to head hunting, the slick technician knows his strengths and weaknesses down to a tee. The only real difference is Kovalev could force his strength on Ward at times and drive him back, Dempsey wasn't the stronger man here so couldn't.

To summise, I hate clinching but when it's allowed how the hell is a LHW ever gonna beat this man? He's incredible at what he does and only a handful in history could or should be favoured over him.

 

ANDRE WARD 114 | 113 SERGEY KOVALEV
This is upon 3rd viewing/scoring.
Rounds 1,2,4,6 & 10 Kovalev Rounds 3,5,7,8,9,11 & 12 Ward.

Scored it for Ward the first 2 times viewing 115 | 113 Ward
Rounds 2,4,6 & 10 Kovalev Rounds 3,5,7,8,9,11 & 12 Ward with Round 1 even.

 

Fight 64: Langford vs Jeannette

One thing that I always think about this is the criticism for the lack of jab on the part of Langford.

To me it's an understanding of his ring IQ. Jeannette was very adept at out fighting especially when against come forward fighting men such as Langford and McVey.

Jeannette is very quick on his feet and has longer arms than Langford and probably quicker than Langford.

There is zero chance of Sam winning any jabbing exchanges plus that isn't the way he fights.

Sam is a tank who sharp shoots without having to set his feet. The way he cuts the ring off here is something Kovalev could have benefitted from against Ward. Sam basically stalks his prey, launches a big punch and then tries to follow up with a big combination. This isn't a lack of technique for me, this is an understanding of what he had to do to win the fight.

So rather than focus on the lack of jabbing (which isn't a bad thing in this situation) let's look at what he did do. He cut the ring off just about as good as anyone ever did, he timed his punches every time Joe dropped his hands. He kept his momentum and balance when he threw the big shots and he was too strong to be effectively clinched by a man his own size.

Looking at the LHW scene today the best boxer is Ward. Ward would win any jabbing exchange but is he gonna be able to keep away from Sam? Not a chance. Is he gonna be able to smother the work of the smaller man, I'm not sure as Ward is very strong himself. You can bet every time Ward throws a jab Sam will launch an attack and drive him back. But not going in straight lines like Segey did. I say Sam walks him down and pushes his **** in, just as he did to Jeannette here.

 

Fight 65: Patterson vs Liston

1: tko

I forgot just how patient Liston is here. He stalks behind a jab and doesn't just start swinging for the fences.

Also I had forgotten Patterson's game plan. He didn't try staying away. He tried to win the battle of the jabs and clinch up close.

This fight shows just how useless a clinch is if the opponent is strong enough. The finishing blow was initiated by Patterson. He threw a jab and then clinched, Liston pushed his off and threw a huge hook, Patterson wasn't able to defend himself and the fight was essentially over.

Clinching is a near unbeatable strategy against a weaker man but if he's stronger than you its suicide.

Liston was a beast here. An absolute beast in against an ATG fighter.

 

Fight 66: Walcott vs Marciano

1: 10-8
2: 10-9
3: 10-9
4: 10-9
5: 10-9
6: 9-10
7: 9-10
8: 10-9
9: 10-9
10: 9-10
11: 10-9
12: 9-10
13 tko

This fight provides the ultimate test for a man with Rocky's style. A cute fighter with respectable power, world class footwork and a quick snappy jab.

There were times when Marciano was a hapless plodder missing by miles. Very rarely did Rocky throw a jab here. He stalked forward, cutting the ring off well and launched an attack with a leaping hook where he would either be hit with a jab or drive Walcott back so he could then unload of a volley of blows.

I can see why many class this as Walcott's finest performance as he often outclassed Rocky here. But what Rocky did exceptionally well is 3 things: he maintained a fantastic level of fitness meaning his power was late, he cut off the ring exceptionally well mean Walcott had to work twice as hard to stay away and he also made Walcott pay for every mistake he made.

The timing of Rocky's punches is often sold short but if you look at this fight, whenever Walcott drops his hands or tried to showboat Rocky was there making him regret that choice.

After the first 5 rounds they began taking rounds tit for tat and the ko blow wasn't a shock. With his work rate Walcott had begun backing to the ropes and getting himself cornered and from that point it's only a matter of time.

A bit like Langford Rocky had very little use of the jab because he knows his limitations. Is that poor technique or good understanding? I don't know.

I do know any man weighing less than 200 pounds will have his work cut out here even if they build up a lead behind the jab as Jersey did.

This does highlight how difficult it would be for him against a SHW opponent as well, a simple step back would remove all of his leverage and against the ropes it would just require a clinch. The jabs he'd eat would have an extra 40 pounds of muscle behind them. Rocky is a great fighter but this version of Rocky does not belong in the modern HW category. This version of Rocky is an incredible pound for pound talent who maximised his assets to deliver incredibly consistent results.

On a side note, I received a VR headset for xmas and this is the first fight I've watched using it. Most videos on YouTube have a "cardboard" setting which allows VR viewing. It's incredibly immersive and it felt like I was ringside for this blockbuster event. I highly recommend it to anyone.