the what fights did you watch today\scorecard thread.

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Mantequilla, Nov 20, 2009.

  1. PhillyPhan69

    PhillyPhan69 Boxing Junkie Full Member

    Dec 20, 2006
    GGG vs Canelo Alvarez I
    This is a decent technical fight, but lacked in some of the excitement I was hoping for both then and now. I don’t know where my original scorecard is but I did end with the same outcome just not sure if the rounds are the same...oh well.

    The fight: in a nutshell I think Álvarez landed the better harder more telling shots. GGG forced the action dictating the pace of the fight and throwing and landing more shots. I know many/most feel GGG won but I feel many rounds could be tight and scored in a variety of ways. I think 116-112 is realistic for either guy although I have it just a bit tighter. Anyone saying it is wider...and well I question your impartiality and judging. The 118-110 card is as poor as the SRL- Hagler 118-110 card, and both mar what were otherwise interesting if not exciting fights.

    Both fighters have/had a lot of in ring respect for the other, as evidenced by some tentativeness reluctance to let it fly. A shame that fans on both sides lack that respect for them both, as they are both great!

    Kenny Bayless deserves some props and for much of the fight I didn’t even realize he was there. He did great at staying out of the video frame and the action, and although it was a pretty clean fight, he didn’t interject other than the few times he needed to. Great job Kenny

    1 Canelo (10-9)
    2 Canelo (Canelo 20-18)
    3 GGG (Canelo 29-28)
    4 GGG (38-38)
    5 GGG (GGG (48-47)
    6 Canelo (57-57)
    7 GGG (GGG 67-66)
    8 GGG (GGG 77-75)
    9 GGG (GGG 87-84)
    10 Canelo (GGG 96-94)
    11 Canelo (GGG 105-104)
    12 Canelo (114-114)
    Draw 114-114

    I think both guys could have done more to win decisively but neither guy did and I am happy with the official draw apart from Byrd’s card which I do feel is among the worst I have seen (SRL 118-110 Hagler or Roland Dakin 149-137 Minter over Antuofermo off the top of my head) and detracts from 2 otherwise solid fighters. I expect to get ripped by GGG fanboys Or Canelo haters but don’t really care.

    I felt there was 2 very very clear not quite wide round but close to it. Rd 4 for GGG and 12 for Canelo (1-1)

    I felt there were 6 close rounds that were still a slight favorite. 3 for GGG 3,7,8 and 3 for Canelo 1,2,11. So after what I feel are 8 fairly easy rounds to score....4-4 which is why I feel 116-112 for either guy is realistic and anything wider is not fair or impartial.

    4 what I felt were very close rounds 5-6 & 9-10 I split between the 2 guys 2-2.... not on purpose lol. I might score these 4 rounds different each time I watch this fight. Once again I am sure many will disagree.

    On the positive side I rewatched this with the UK commentary and found it much more enjoyable and unbiased even though they favored GGG 8-4 & 7-5 they were not actively campaigning for one fighter nor trying to sway viewer opinion like their American counterparts.
  2. PhillyPhan69

    PhillyPhan69 Boxing Junkie Full Member

    Dec 20, 2006
    Álvarez vs GGG II
    Wow! I had forgotten what a great fun and exciting fight this is! Tactical and strategic like the first fight with more fireworks and better exchanges. Round 4 was super exciting, and rounds 5-6 10 & 12 were also fun. Really the whole fight was fun but those 5 rounds really stood out to me. I have scored this fight twice (this is the 3rd) and has Canelo 115-113 and Draw 114-114...TBF I can see anything between 9-3 Canelo or 117-111 to GGG 7-5 or 115-113. I didn’t have it on either wide end but think they are both realistic cards.

    The commentary was much!!!!! improved over the first fight! There was a very slight bend towards GGG, but nothing over the top! Good job in a mostly unbiased commentary!

    Ref: Benjy Esteves Jr. great job! His name does not jump out to me from other fights, but I would guess he has reffed some others. I didn’t even realize there was a ref in the ring after the fight was over! Pretty clean fight like the first one for the most part....but great job from a ref at appearing to not even be there. Good job imo

    The fighters: 2 warriors who I enjoy and appreciate very much... to Canelo fans and GGG haters you are dopes! To GGG fans and Canelo haters you are idiots...I don’t care much for either of their fans, but love watching these 2 guys fight! This is a fun fight marred by jerk spectators on both sides lol

    1 GGG (10-9)
    2 Canelo (19-19)
    3 Canelo (Canelo 29-28)
    4 GGG (38-38)
    5 Canelo (Canelo 48-47)
    6 Canelo (Canelo 58-56)
    7 Canelo (Canelo 68-65)
    8 Canelo (Canelo 78-74)
    9 Canelo (Canelo 88-83)
    10 GGG (Canelo 97-93)
    11 GGG (Canelo 106-103)
    12 Canelo (Canelo 116-112)
    Canelo 116-112 widest my card has ever come out on this fight.

    I think there were 3 very clear rounds! 2-3 for Canelo and 10 for GGG (Canelo 2-1)

    I think there were 5 very close rounds but felt 1 guy was able to separate himself: Canelo in 6-7-8 and GGG in 1-11 (Canelo 3-2/5-3).

    I think there are 4 rounds that could be fairly scored 4-0/3-1/2-2 for either guy. Canelo 5-9-12 GGG 4. I think those 4 rounds translate to 117-111 for Álvarez or 115-113 GGG. I think the judges did a good job at scoring a tough fight. They were all unanimous 1-6 & 10-11 and scored it 4-4 in rounds. This is where what I felt were 4 close rounds to determine the outcome of this fight, and the judges were divided on all 4 rounds as opposed to the other 8 listed above. 6-8 all 3 were divided with 2 scoring 2-1 for Canelo and the 3rd (judge with the draw card) had it 3-0 Canelo. All 3 judges had it 6-5 Canelo going into the 12th with the draw card judge scoring for GGG and the other 2 for Canelo equaling their 2 115-113 cards.

    To me 4-5-9-12 are really the only debatable rounds of the fight and however you see/score them is fine by me...I would only question the other 8 rounds that I feel were fairly clear.
    oldcanvasback and KO KIDD like this.
  3. PhillyPhan69

    PhillyPhan69 Boxing Junkie Full Member

    Dec 20, 2006
    Ortega vs Paret
    While I am waiting for the next installment of FOTW I decided to finally watch this! What a great fun exciting 10 rd war. I could see 7-3 for either guy or anywhere between as is super tough to score these rounds. I might score it totally different tomorrow. Not sure how this has slipped my radar for so long, as this should be a staple on any “great fights” list and will now be one I use when responding to those threads! Thanks for posting your cards or I may not have even come across this one to sit down and watch!

    RBR (I have no confidence in my scorecard lol)
    1 Paret
    2 Paret
    3 Ortega
    4 Ortega
    5 Draw
    6 Paret
    7 Paret
    8 Ortega
    9 Ortega
    10 Ortega

    What a fun fight I had Ortega nipping it 5-4-1 (and if I had to fall off the fence in rd 5 I might go Ortega? Making it 6-4)...but what a fun fight I can see why the judges, media and fans were split...this is the epitome of a both guys deserved the win type of fight.
    scartissue and salsanchezfan like this.
  4. PhillyPhan69

    PhillyPhan69 Boxing Junkie Full Member

    Dec 20, 2006
    Camacho vs Mancini
    Wow! What a dreadful fight to sit through! This is the fourth (and final lol) time I have watched this. Once live before I scored fights and twice having it 116-112 Mancini. I have always felt this was a robbery (I used that word a lot when I was younger), now I just feel it was close and NEITHER guy deserved to win.

    The combination of ring size, Camacho’s lack of interest in engaging and tying up, Mancini’s lack of conditioning and ring rust leading him to also tie up too much; made for a dreadful fight to watch....what a let down! I can’t believe I used to get worked up over this horrific fight that no one should ever have to rewatch or rescore.

    Side note Mills Lane did perhaps his worst officiating job, but in his defense Camacho didn’t want to engage, and mancini’s fatigue lack of conditioning didn’t help on the other side...

    Anyway my RBR for the final time
    1 Camacho
    2 Mancini (19-19)
    3 Mancini (Mancini 29-28)
    4 Mancini (Mancini 39-37)
    5 Camacho (Mancini 48-47)
    6 Camacho (57-57)
    7 Camacho (Camacho 67-66)
    8 Mancini (76-76)
    9 Camacho (Camacho 86-85)
    10 Mancini (95-95)
    11 Mancini (Mancini 105-104)
    12 Camacho (114-114)

    The decision is fair IMO in retrospect and the judges had their work cut out for them. There were really no decisive clear rounds, and I felt like Camacho edged Mancini 3-2 in very close semi clear rounds. And Mancini edged Camacho 4-3 in ultra tight close rounds with very little action. I can see 116-112 for either guy as reasonable and no longer will I cry robbery. Sorry it took me so long to see the light!
  5. cleming

    cleming Active Member Full Member

    Sep 3, 2012
    Leonardo Cruz vs Loris Stecca

    Tremendous stuff.
  6. Jack Catterall

    Jack Catterall New Member Full Member

    Nov 28, 2018
    De la Hoya vs Shane Mosley 2 (114-114)
  7. scartissue

    scartissue Boxing Addict Full Member

    Mar 2, 2006
    Philly, finally sat down to watch this one and, although I was comfortable with my score, this is a fight that could likely test your patience, what you look for, and your confidence when you actually hear the scores. Anyways, here is how I had it.

    Round 1: 10-9 Camacho
    Round 2: 10-10 Even
    Round 3: 10-9 Mancini
    Round 4: 10-9 Mancini
    Round 5: 10-9 Mancini
    Round 6: 10-9 Mancini
    Round 7: 10-9 Camacho
    Round 8: 10-9 Mancini
    Round 9:10-9 Mancini
    Round 10: 10-9 Mancini
    Round 11: 10-10 Even
    Round 12: 10-9 Camacho

    Total: 117-113 Mancini

    After the 8th round I heard Sean O'Grady say, "Great round for Camacho." I said, WTF is he watching? All I saw was a brief flurry at the end of the round by Camacho which looked good but I'm not going to forget about the 3/4 of the round that Ray chased, punched and hit Hector while Hec was clinching. When Hector could keep Ray in the ring center, he was golden, but Ray was all over him and it was just brief flurries from Hector. The first time I saw it I felt Ray won without scoring it. Now that I take pen in hand, I think Ray was robbed. BTW, official scores were 116-112 for Mancini and two scores of 115-113 for Hector.
    PhillyPhan69 likes this.
  8. PhillyPhan69

    PhillyPhan69 Boxing Junkie Full Member

    Dec 20, 2006
    Tony The Tiger Lopez vs Rocky Lockridge I
    Wow! Definitely FOTY worthy! I forgot what a fun fight this was.

    Both guys deserved to win and they were throwing nonstop. There was so much action I felt like the round was over and I would see the clock still saying a minute and half left in almost every round.

    The judges had their work cut out for them as 8 of the rounds could go the other way and I wouldn’t be upset.

    Shout out to referee Robert Byrd who did a great job, and outside of the KD and 1 break in the 11th I forgot he was even there.

    1 Lopez (10-9)
    2 Lopez (Lopez 20-18)
    3 Lopez (Lopez 30-27)
    4 Lockridge (Lopez 39-37)
    5 Lopez (Lopez 49-46)
    6 Lopez (Lopez 59-55)
    7 Lopez (Lopez 69-64)
    8 Lockridge 10-8 (Lopez 77-74)
    9 Lockridge (Lopez 86-84)
    10 Lockridge (Lopez 95-94)
    11 Lopez (Lopez 105-103)
    12 Lopez (Lopez 115-112)

    Lopez did a great job surviving the final minute of round 8, and collecting his wits during 9. He came on in the 2nf half of round 10 and almost took it on my card.

    Lockridge did a great job (as did his corner) after getting rocked in 5 and rocked and a bad cut on his eyelid in 6, to stay on point and turn the tide. He turned on the pressure in 8-10 to make this a super tough fight.

    Fun fight to watch...if you have not seen it add it to your to watch list
    oldcanvasback likes this.
  9. PhillyPhan69

    PhillyPhan69 Boxing Junkie Full Member

    Dec 20, 2006
    Tony the Tiger Lopez vs Rocky Lockridge II
    Not quite as good as the first fight but still a very exciting fight to watch. There seems to be some controversy over whether or not Lockridge was KD’d in round 1....looks like a clear flash KD to me? Some say it was ruled a slip? But at least 2 of the judges scored 2 10-8 rounds to get the totals...and if the 3rd judge had an even round (very possible with at least 6 tough to score rounds), then he did as well.

    Lockridge did a great job getting back into this fight after 1/2 KD’s. Lopez did a great job (as did his corner) but not allowing his cut to take him off his plan.

    Awesome fight to watch if you have not seen it....or to rewatch if it has been a while.

    Lopez 10-8
    2 Lopez (Lopez 20-17)
    3 Lopez 10-8 (Lopez 30-25)
    4 Lopez (Lopez 40-34)
    5 Lopez (Lopez 50-43)
    6 Lockridge (Lopez 59-53)
    7 Lockridge (Lopez 68-63)
    8 Lopez (Lopez 78-72)
    9 Lockridge (Lopez 87-82)
    10 Lopez (Lopez 97-91)
    11 Lockridge (Lopez 106-101)
    12 Lockridge (Lopez 115-111)

    115-111 Tony The Tiger Lopez
  10. PhillyPhan69

    PhillyPhan69 Boxing Junkie Full Member

    Dec 20, 2006
    Tony the Tiger Lopez vs John John Molina I
    Continuing my journey through Lopez’s career. This fight is reminiscent of DLH vs Tito. Molina is outboxing Lopez early but gets on his bike to early in this fight. He pretty much gives away 6-9 and the early lead he built up, then when he receives the low blow deduction in 11 he was behind on my card to far to come back. A shame he gave this fight away in 6-9, and 10-12 sealed the deal. No hometown decision, just a boxer who mismanaged a fight.

    1 Even
    2 Molina10-8 (Molina 20-18)
    3 Lopez (Molina 29-28)
    4 Molina (Molina 39-37)
    5 Molina 10-8 (Molina 49-45)
    6 Lopez (Molina 58-55)
    7 Lopez (Molina 67-65)
    8 Lopez (Molina 76-75)
    9 Lopez (85-85)
    10 Lopez (Lopez 95-94)
    11 Lopez 10-8 (Lopez 105-102)
    12 Lopez (Lopez 115-111)

    Lopez 115-111

    I scored round 5 (No KD) a 10-8 round for Molina. Started a thread on this round to see how others score it.

    Here is the vid and thread link 6:45 of the vid starts the round

    Thread link if you want to give your opinion

    This content is protected
  11. PhillyPhan69

    PhillyPhan69 Boxing Junkie Full Member

    Dec 20, 2006
    Tony The Tiger Lopez vs John John Molina II
    What a brutal one sided beating. The crowds response of showering the ring was disgraceful! It should never have come to that anyway! Tony’s corner should have stopped this between 6-10 anyhow and spared Tony and the ref from this decision. Tony pretty much couldn’t see out of his right midway through the 3rd combined with the left eye cut in 6....he just couldn’t see to land or defend himself.

    Total shutout for Molina 90-81. I could see 89-82 if you gave Lopez the close 2nd round. But not sure how you can give him the 2 rounds the 3rd judge scored for him. Total brilliant one sided boxing display from John John
  12. PhillyPhan69

    PhillyPhan69 Boxing Junkie Full Member

    Dec 20, 2006
    Tony the Tiger Lopez vs John John Molina III
    Man, this is a fun fight and while it will never overtake Taylor vs JCC in terms of hype or nostalgia I think this fight was much superior and has a case for FOTY in 1990.

    I hate the narrative that Tony only beat Molina because of home cooking or home town decisions. To me he won I & III and to take away from them seems a shame.

    1 Molina
    2 Molina (Molina 20-18)
    3 Molina (Molina 30-27)
    4 Lopez (Molina 39-37)
    5 Lopez (Molina 48-47)
    6 Lopez (57-57)
    7 Lopez (Lopez 67-66)
    8 Lopez (Lopez 77-75)
    9 Molina (Lopez 86-85)
    10 Molina (95-95)
    11 Lopez 10-8 (Lopez 105-103)
    12 Lopez (Lopez 115-112)

    Lopez 115-112
    But man there are 8 closely contested tough to score rounds that I had 4 a piece, this is no robbery or hometown decision, just a great closely contested battle!!!!

    Check this one out
  13. oldcanvasback

    oldcanvasback Member Full Member

    Jan 26, 2018
    Just watched Ricardo Mayorga vs Oscar De La Hoya.

    Say what you want about old fishnets but he could really fight.
    Smart, strong and tough. Mayorga weighed 172 on fight night and looked every ounce of that while De La Hoya was coming off a nearly 2 year lay off.
    1. 10-8
    2. 10-9
    3. 10-9
    4. 10-9
    5. 10-9
    6. Ref stops bout
    50 - 44 De La Hoya.
    Mayorga always threw everything at opponents - low blows, head butts, shots to the back of the head. His fights always had a lot of action.
    De La Hoya was to smart and straight.
    PhillyPhan69 likes this.
  14. PhillyPhan69

    PhillyPhan69 Boxing Junkie Full Member

    Dec 20, 2006
    Tony the Tiger Lopez vs Jorge Paez
    An underrated war, where both men dig deep and took it to each other all night. A fight that is much closer within the rounds than on my scorecard (or the official ones). The rounds are close but fairly easy to score I felt. I remember this fight live and was one of my most anticipated fights as a teen.

    1 Lopez
    2 Paez
    3 Lopez
    4 Lopez
    5 Lopez
    6 Paez
    7 Lopez
    8 Lopez
    9 Lopez
    10 Paez
    11 Lopez
    12 Lopez

    117-111 Lopez
    Good fight to check out if you have not seen it
  15. PhillyPhan69

    PhillyPhan69 Boxing Junkie Full Member

    Dec 20, 2006
    Brian Mitchell vs Tony the Tiger Lopez I

    2 of my favorites as a teen (and today) both get underrated or under appreciated in my mind.

    I really feel this is a close fight and that literally every round could be scored opposite of mine and I would not argue. I found this one of the toughest fights to score.

    Lopez- much better defensively than the narrative about him might suggest and he makes Mitchell miss a lot. He uses his jab very effectively for 10 rounds (dispelling another narrative that he is merely a limited inside body puncher), landing several in succession and follows well to the body. He also showed better counterpunching skills than I have attributed to him previously. He does a great job as Mitchell’s own jab became more effective in timing Mitchell and countering his jab with one of his own. He did solid work both leading and countering. He also to me landed the far heavier blows.

    Mitchell a brilliant slick technician. He is/was a brilliant defensive fighter both fundamentally and with head movement and reflexes. His ring generalship especially over the final 4 rounds or so was top notch. His hand speed and combinations caused all sorts of trouble for Tony. In the beginning Tony’s jab was controlling the fight and distance allowing him use his 4 inches of reach against Mitchell. But by the 3rd Mitchell would begin to utilize his own as his movement allowed him to slip inside. Mitchell is a better infighter than I have previously attributed to him. Mitchell’s superior/excellent conditioning allowed him to control the final 3 rounds. Awesome fighter.

    Awesome fight FOTY worthy IMO. Both guys struggled with swollen eyes, but were able to fight through that at a high level. And although it was Mitchell’s who looked worse it seemed to affect Tony more late. I felt Tony’s eye, late fight accuracy and poor conditioning left the door open for Mitchell to steal this fight.

    I know the popular narrative is that Mitchell was robbed and Tony got a home town decision. I hate that Pacheco started this false narrative after the first Lopez vs Molina fight (Tony won IMO) staying that Molina won the first 6 rounds...FALSE! I don’t think robbery or gift is fair to either fighter and felt Lopez had as much of a claim to winning as Mitchell and can see 7-5/8-4 for either guy without being upset or questioning it. Once again if you can get by the crowd/commentary biases and appreciate this fight and these fighters it is a fight well worth watching or revisiting.

    1 Lopez
    2 Lopez
    3 Mitchell
    4 Mitchell
    5 Lopez
    6 Lopez
    7 Mitchell
    8 Lopez
    9 Lopez
    10 Mitchell
    11 Mitchell
    12 Mitchell

    114-114 Draw on my card and both guys fought incredible.

    I felt like Tony was controlling the fight and his jab and body work were mopping rounds. I had him up 6-3 after 9 rounds. But his conditioning and accuracy plummeted in the final 3 rounds allowing Mitchell to steal a draw. I don’t mean steal like he didn’t deserve it, but more that Lopez let this slip away.