the what fights did you watch today\scorecard thread.

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Mantequilla, Nov 20, 2009.



  1. scartissue

    scartissue Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Philly, here is another abbreviated contest, but one worth watching, between Antonio Cervantes and Carlos Gimenez (the rematch). Here is how I saw it after 5 completed rounds. It's not much in length to test your scoring skills, but it is worth watching.

    Round 1: Cervantes
    Round 2: Gimenez
    Round 3: Cervantes
    Round 4: Cervantes
    Round 5: Gimenez

    Fight stopped between the 5th and 6th round due to a cut Gimenez. What ensues is worth watching. Gimenez' manager (Tito Lectoure I think) physically accosts referee Marty Denkin. It is difficult to tell who stopped the fight (Denkin or the doctor) and if Lectoure is claiming there wasn't much of a cut or is he complaining about the head-butts. They feel hard-done by and to tell you the truth, they have a good argument. Gimenez is one tough dude and really good on the inside. Cervantes' punches were very sharp and crisp but he was being nullified a bit by Gimenez' infighting. And to be honest, I'm a big Cervantes fan but his head was coming in like a torpedo and despite Gimenez complaining to Denkin, all Denkin appeared to do was tap both of their heads as if to say 'be careful'. Would have liked to have seen this fight progress.
     
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  2. PhillyPhan69

    PhillyPhan69 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Thanks! I was planning on looking at some Cervantes after Galaxy...I hope to check this out next week. Enjoyed your write up!
     
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  3. Jel

    Jel Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Miguel Cotto v Ricardo Torres

    A forgotten little gem that's worth a watch if you have a spare half an hour.

    Two young unbeaten fighters laying their records and fledgling reputations on the line. And boy did they lay it all out there!

    No feeling out process at all as Cotto tags Torres towards the end of the opening round to score the first knockdown. Torres bounces back up though and wobbles Cotto! Flying start.

    Round 2 is practically an assault as Torres rocks Cotto several times before finally dropping him.

    Round 3 sees a couple of low blows from Cotto that stops Torres momentum and by the end of round 4 when another borderline shot drops Torres again, Cotto looks to have turned things his way. But not so fast ... Torres turns predator again in round 5, rocking Cotto and chasing him around the ring for most of the round, doing damage. No knockdown this time but still potentially a 10-8 round anyway.

    Round 6 is probably the first round where they appear to be taking a breather, but Cotto reasserts control and punctuates it with a right cross that puts Torres down again at the end of the round.

    Torres looks pretty much spent but manages one more quick flurry at the start of round 7 that appears to rock Cotto but Miguel recovers quickly and drops Torres, who this time can't make it to his feet.

    Cotto keeps his unbeaten record and WBO light welterweight belt but knows he's been in a war.
     
    Last edited: May 9, 2019
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  4. scartissue

    scartissue Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Jel, great fight. I know I saw it first time around but it seemed fresh to me again. I had it scored exactly like Harold Lederman after 6 rounds. 56-53 with Cotto leading
     
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  5. Jel

    Jel Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Yeah, no argument with Lederman's scoring in this one. Cotto looks at least one weight division bigger than Torres and I think it was that extra strength more than anything that got him through. I'd be interested to know what the weight difference between them was by the time they entered the ring.
     
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  6. PhillyPhan69

    PhillyPhan69 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Khaokor Galaxy vs Sung Kil Moon I

    Still going through some Galaxy brothers fights. This is a fun 5 rounder but the headbutt leading to stoppage takes some of the shine off of it.

    Moon starts strong against a sloppy/unprepared Galaxy....or at least that was how I felt after watching Galaxy Vazquez.

    Moon very patient shows some solid skills and lands the better harder punches. He goes up 2-0 on my card after 2 onesided rounds.

    Galaxy comes on on 3-5 working the body good. But Moon continues to Outland and outwork Khaokor. Very close rds but I felt Moon edged them.

    Judge 1 Moon 5-0 (I agree)
    Judge 2 Moon 1-0-4 (Wow)
    Judge 3 Moon 2-1-2 (I can at least see this)

    I really feel like had things continued they were setting things up for Khaokor to edge a controversial close Split decision?

    Inadvertent headbutt early in 6, looks like a common southpaw vs orthodox clash with both guys moving in simultaneously and Moon coming out the worse for west.

    Nasty gash and yes the fight should be stopped although that is a disappointing ending.

    Moon wins 6TD

    Khaokor looks disgusted by the scorecards but not sure why.
     
  7. PhillyPhan69

    PhillyPhan69 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Khaokor Galaxy vs Sung Kil Moon II

    Wow! For a 1 sided beatdown this is a vastly entertaining fight, and Khaokor’s performance is among the most brilliant in history, and the gutsy determination of Moon in a losing effort is inspired.

    The post fight scene after the fight is a picture that speaks volumes. Moon in his corner slumped down his face looks like he has been jumped by 3 guys...Khaokor in the middle of the ring with his team combing his hair back looks like he is going to a pre fight press conference rather than coming out of a 12 rd fight.

    I have always wondered why Galaxy took a year of fighting lightly regarded opposition following their first fight, but after watching this he must have ate slept and fought this fight in his mind 1000 times. He had an answer for everything Moon did, and he was so fluid he made it look effortless.

    The only rds I found to be close in regards to scoring are 4/10 and they are both exciting fun rounds. Despite the lopsided nature of the fight Moon was full of resolve and his face revealed no frustration until the KD’s of rd 11. He kept coming forward, and his chin is top notch because he endured a load of heavy blows.

    The judges did not have Galaxy losing a round but 2 of them found 3 even rounds and the 3rd found 6. I didn’t score any even and only find 2 close enough 4/10 to warrant that?

    Either way total shutout for me with rd 11 being a 10-7 rd for 120-106

    2 judges had 120-109 the 3rd 120-112
     
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  8. oldcanvasback

    oldcanvasback Member Full Member

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    Miguel Cotto 26-0 (22 ko) v Paulie Malignaggi 22-0 (5 ko)
    2006-06-10 WBO 140lbs title
    Rd.1- A clash of heads cuts Paulie's eye in the first 10 seconds. Malignaggi's aggressive, picking spots to come forward. Throws a lot of leather for round 1. Lands lands some 1-2's and left hooks working exclusively to the head. in every clinch he moves the wrong way to protect his eye and has to duck in clinches to avoid scrapping the cut on Cotto's head. Cotto is not flustered by Paulie's activity and throws some variety to body and head, already trying uppercuts. Should be Paulie's round based on activity but Cotto's able to land enough solid punches to make it even.
    10 - 10
    Rd.2- Cotto comes out more active but Malignaggi maintains his work rate. Cotto throwing left body hooks, Malignaggi right body hooks. Both step with their jabs and Malignaggi steps straight back - not to the side when Cotto jabs. Double left jab to the body and Paulie retreats straight back into a corner then tries to jab his way out, walking into a left hand and is dropped about 1 minute into the round. Cotto applies pressure walking forward patiently. Paulie tries to change the momentum by throwing two 3 piece combo's but gets nailed with 2 crisp left hooks upstairs with a minute to go. Cotto puts weight into his jabs and hooks, upstairs and down.
    10 - 8 Cotto
    20 - 18 Cotto
    Rd.3- Paulie more defensivley responsible now, shoulder rolling and moving his feet. Both know that Cotto can hurt Pauilie but he can't hurt Cotto who throws stiff double jabs on the outside, hooks and straights inside snapping Malignaggi's head here and there.
    10 - 9 Cotto
    30 - 27 Cotto
    Rd.4- Cotto dominant but not rushing. He's got better balance and moves more efficiently than Malignaggi whose wariness exaggerates his movements and makes him easier to read. Miguel landing upstairs and really working the body. He takes it up a notch in the last 40 seconds landing solid hooks to the body.
    10 - 9 Cotto
    40 - 36 Cotto.
    Rd.5- Paulie starts out of range and is able to land jabs on Cotto coming in. Lands a 1-2, his best combo so far. Seems to forget about the range which allows Miguel to work the body again. Cotto more hook focused this round and lands a nice 3-4-3 combo cleanly.
    10 - 9 Cotto
    50 - 45 Cotto
    Rd.6- Fight is unfolding predictably. Paulie better at keeping distance here and initiating a lot more clinches. Miguel hooking to the body. Cotto lands beautiful flush hooks with a minute to go and again with 30 seconds to go. Malignaggi's 1-2's are very predictable now, no feints and not coming in off beats so they are taken on the gloves. Closer round though.
    10 - 9 Cotto
    60 - 54 Cotto
    Rd.7- Malignaggi mixes his timing and placement on his 1-2's and looks better till Cotto left hook. Miguel wises up to the clinching and is able to get his hands free. Lands hooks up stairs and down. It's getting dull b/c the same things happen every round at around the same time. I wish Cotto would wrestle Pauile into a corner and knock him out.
    10 - 9 Cotto
    70 - 63 Cotto
    Rd.8- Paulie's last stand? Actually throws hooks, changes angles and comes forward. He has no power though but he's upped the ante and is at least attacking. It's courageous though and I appreciate the effort. I don't think Paulie's used a high guard once. Just stays in the philly shell which is too predictable. Paulie must've found boxing easy when he was a teen b/c he has all the pretty and flashy parts of boxing down but few of the tools you actually need to compete at a high level. After a while Miguel thinks f*** you and throws Paulie to the canvas. I'll give this even just 'cos
    10 - 10
    80 - 73 Cotto
    Rd.9- When Paulie Attacks! Very busy from Malignaggi. Throws a lot on the outside and draws even at least on the inside. There's just not enough time for Cotto who is determind to be defensively responsible. 30 seconds to go and Paulie cracks Miguel with an overhand right that staggers Cotto or (more likely) caught him off balance. Italian Americans in the crowd go ape. Between rounds camera shows bad swelling on Malignaggi's jaw from left hooks.
    9 - 10 Malignaggi
    89 - 83 Cotto
    Rd.10- Activity form Paulie again. Crowd chanting 'Paulie, Paulie'. Both land good uppercuts in clinches. Cotto's is better but the crowd loses it for Paulie's. Last minute is full of clinches where Cotto gets his hands free and left-rights the body putting his weight into them.
    10 - 9 Cotto
    99 - 92 Cotto
    Rd.11- In the first minute the crowd loses it three times for eye catching Malignaggi punches. Two lefts and a right. One may stagger Cotto or he's off balance again. In between these punches Cotto is just quietly breaking him down like a butcher does a side of beef. Paulie is bleeding heavily from the nose or mouth. The longer the round goes the more dominant Cotto is. Paulie showing great heart. Giving it his all but he doesn't have the fire power to compete. Cotto takes his time. Defending, jabbing and hooking. He does what the situation dictates like the true pro he is. Almost a 10 - 8. Commentators wondering if it's wise to continue. Between rounds it's obvious that the blood is coming from Paulie's mouth. His jaw is broken. The swelling is like Ali's v Frazier 1.
    10 - 9 Cotto
    109 - 101
    Rd.12- Bell rings and Cotto launches a scud missile of a jab. Paulie holds on for dear life. The round is Paulie tying up trying to survive and Cotto occasionally getting his hands free to punish (mostly) the body. The bell rings.
    Paulie won a lot of fans with his courage. I didn't think he had this much heart.
    10 - 9 Cotto

    My Score: 119 - 110 Cotto
    Official: Don Trella 115 - 112, Glen Feldman 116 - 111, Peter Trematerra 116 - 111
    UD Cotto
    There's no way I could find 3 rounds for Paulie, let alone 4. I'd love to know which rounds they gave him.
    Judges may've been influenced by the crowd or maybe I'm a crap judge.
     
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  9. PhillyPhan69

    PhillyPhan69 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Good post! This has been in my notebook for 2 months to review but have not bumped it up my to watch list yet. Interesting take. I remember having it 116-111? Or that ballpark? But you seem to be on the wider end of the spectrum...not saying your take is wrong. I remember being impressed by Paulies toughness in this fight, I thought he would cave and get stopped around 9-10. Perhaps I gave him some close rounds based on guttiness but I am not sure! I need to move this up my list with Cotto vs Margo II
     
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  10. oldcanvasback

    oldcanvasback Member Full Member

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    Thanks man, I usually favor the boxer in fights but I thought Cotto's shots were harder and therefore, worth more. Apart from his left hook, I don't think his punches are 'eye catching' but to my eye, they are there. I've got no problem with 116-111. There were a few rounds where Paulie's very active and like you said, I didn't think Paulie could stand up to Cotto's punches. Hats off to him, he has courage.
    Cotto - Margo 2 is a great fight. I'll give it a watch soon.
     
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  11. scartissue

    scartissue Boxing Addict Full Member

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    When this took place way back when, I was out of the country and called home to ask my Dad about the fight. When he said Mamby knocked out DeJesus, I couldn't believe it. Never saw the fight until now, so thanks for bringing it to my attention, Philly.

    Round 1: 10-9 DeJesus
    Round 2: 10-9 DeJesus
    Round 3: 10-10 Even
    Round 4: 10-9 DeJesus
    Round 5: 10-9 Mamby
    Round 6: 10-9 Mamby
    Round 7: 10-9 Mamby
    Round 8: 10-10 Even
    Round 9: 10-9 Mamby
    Round 10: 10-9 Mamby
    Round 11: 10-9 Mamby
    Round 12: 10-8 Mamby (scores a knockdown)
    Round 13: Mamby stops DeJesus

    Total (through 12 completed rounds): 117-112 Mamby

    After the first four rounds when DeJesus was fresh and able to get inside, he did well. But Mamby played a waiting game and slowly chipped away. To his credit, DeJesus never stopped trying, but the wind came out of his sails in the 12th and was done like dinner.
     
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  12. The Undefeated Lachbuster

    The Undefeated Lachbuster Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Hurd vs Williams:

    8-3-1

    117-111 for Williams.
     
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  13. PhillyPhan69

    PhillyPhan69 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Saman Sorjaturong vs Humberto Gonzalez
    1995 FOTY

    Not sure how I have missed this one through the years? Rounds 3-7 are definitely FOTY worthy.

    Saman comes out boxing good, quick feet and hands darting in and out not letting it turn into an infight. Gonzalez looks slow and wide and wild in his punches gets caught off balance for a Flash KD (almost does again in 4 but stays up). At this point I am thinking it will be a walk through for Saman.

    After the KD Gonzalez is not really hurt and holds his own the rest of the round. Ends with a nasty accidental southpaw vs orthodox headbutt that leaves Saman with a bump and cut above the left eye.

    Rd 3 ultra close! Gonzalez begins stalking and cutting off the ring more effectively, and edges a very close rd.

    Rd 4-6 Gonzalez has turned this around and is in complete control. Round 4 is amazing to me, and he drops Saman in 5.

    Rd 6 closer rd, and I am wondering how to score it when Gonzalez unleashes and drops him again.

    Rd 7 Saman digs deep and comes out firing away, Gonzalez quickly matches him and a slugfest breaks out. 2 perfect rights by Saman and Gonzalez goes down, gets up a mask of blood running down his face. Saman backs him up and unleashed a barrage the ref steps in as Gonzalez is out on his feet. All over!

    Very fun fight.....
    I felt Saman took 1-2 up 20-17
    Gonzalez 3-6 up 57-54

    I feel like the judges were off a hair.
    1 scored 1 even
    1 scored 1 for Gonzalez
    1 scored 1 for Gonzalez and 2 only a 10-9 despite Gonzalez getting Kd’d.

    1/3 were very close and could be even or both for Gonzalez even though I didn’t...but to score 2 a 10-9 rd as well rather than 10-8 stinks! Glad this didn’t go to the cards.

    Gonzalez goes out like a great warrior deserves to go out! Covered with blood but still on his feet, after giving a brutal beating inside. Good fight!
     
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  14. PhillyPhan69

    PhillyPhan69 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Erik Morales vs Manny Pacquiao I

    What a great! fun! Fight to rewatch!

    This fight is very closely contested throughout and outside of 2-4-11 for Morales and 1-9-12 for Pac I find this fight very hard to score. 6 very close rds I had 4-2 for Morales so my result equaled the judges and I saw it closer to Merchant than Lederman.

    There were a few headbutts due to the south paw vs orthodox style that occurred. The first in rd 2 the 2nd in rd 5 and the 3 rd later in rd 5 that led to a bad cut on Manny. It definitely impacted the fight, but I don’t want to say it impacted the decision.....but I had manny up 3-2 at the time and Morales 5-2 the rest of the way. Was it due to the cut or was Érik just on his A game this night and it wouldn’t matter?

    Great ebbs and flows and mid rd momentum shifts, with good back and forth exchanges.

    RBR
    1 Pac
    2 Morales
    3 Pac
    4 Morales
    5 Pac
    6 Morales
    7 Morales
    8 Morales
    9 Pac
    10 Morales
    11 Morales
    12 Morales

    Morales 115-113

    Not sure why Érik fought southpaw in the 12th. He didn’t look good and had his worst rd of the fight.
     
  15. PhillyPhan69

    PhillyPhan69 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Orlando Salido vs Vasyl Lomachenko

    A decent tactical and strategic fight between Lomachenko in his 2nd pro fight vs the savvy Salido. Salido gives up his title by coming in over weight and then rehydrating 19 lbs for a huge weight advantage.

    The commentary was bad but I did enjoy the way they critiqued cole and his horrible performance reffing this fight.

    Salido works the body good and his extra size makes it difficult for Loma to adjust. Loma can’t seem to get comfortable until around 10 and by then it was to late...at least as far as the official result goes. I scored Loma on fight night, this time I had a draw. I can see a 1 pt win for either guy, 116-112 Salido seems on the widest end of the spectrum but I wouldn’t call it unrealistic, just that all 4 of the close rds had to go in his direction.

    RBR
    1 Lomachenko
    2 Salido
    3 Salido
    4 Salido
    5 Lomachenko
    6 Lomachenko
    7 Salido
    8 Salido
    9 Salido
    10 Lomachenko
    11 Lomachenko
    12 Lomachenko

    114-114 for me