Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Mantequilla, Nov 20, 2009.
Once again Chuck, proving that you are indeed the man.
Sorry, just logged on. Yes, that's the one. With a 51:38 length. Thanks, Chuck. Hope you like it, George. Patterson had a real issue for about the first 2 1/2 rounds with Zaragoza's southpaw style. His lopping shots from the opposite angle were really posing an issue until Patterson seemed to half-solve it late in the 3rd round. Again, I felt tissue-paper thin rounds as they were both so evenly matched. Despite my score, I felt the Draw was correct.
I just rewatched the Wilford Scypion v James 'Hardrock' Green fight because I remembered it being a good fight. I scored it earlier in the year and had it 4-4-2 first time around but now have a 5-4-1 for Green. Suffice to say I had it very close both times and loved some of the ferocious exchanges by these two. Good fight.
Murray Sutherland v Chong Pal Park (super middleweight title)
Round 1: 10-10 Even
Round 2: 10-8 Sutherland (scores a knockdown)
Round 3: 10-10 Even
Round 4: 10-9 Park
Round 5: 10-9 Park
Round 6: 10-8 Park (scores a knockdown)
Round 7: 10-9 Sutherland
Round 8: 10-8 Park (scores a knockdown)
Round 9: 10-10 Even
Round 10: 10-9 Park
Round 11: Park drops Sutherland twice and the bout is stopped
Total through 10 completed rounds: 97-93 Park (actual scores not known)
An interesting bout with a lot of drama once Park realized Murray's body was his Achilles heel. After dropping Sutherland he would punch himself out every time and Murray would come back the next round. His sharp and accurate counters were doing a number on Park's eyes, but the Korean was very strong and went right back to the body once he caught his next wind. Realistically, although an enjoyable fight, Murray was really only a very good journeyman and Park was a good banger but one-dimensional. They had plateaued in the real divisions, but both of these fighters benefitted greatly by the creation of super-middle.
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Scorecard: -mbmbmmbbb (94-95 at time of stoppage, Bernal one round ahead but docked a point in the sixth and another in the tenth)
Bernal was making his first title defense less than two months after winning it, and trying to become the first WBC Fly champ to successfully defend the belt since August '81. This was an exciting fight with a lot of fast-paced exchanges on the inside. After a tentative first (which I scored even, something I try to avoid doing), Montero really starting pouring it all in against a much stronger foe. He was always determined to have the last say in any exchange, and he was throwing more and throwing faster than Bernal. The champion showed his characteristic imperturbability, calm even to a fault as he didn't make any real effort to increase the pace even as his opponent appeared to be outpointing him. He struggled to solve Montero's high guard. Occasionally his uppercuts got through but most of his best scoring came from bodyshots, which Montero admirably tried to match and which ended up costing Bernal a couple of points (more on that later). Although he enjoyed a clear strength advantage and bulled Montero around the ring at points, Bernal failed to dominate on the inside, either, as Montero frequently charged off the ropes with combinations after finding himself pinned there.
Late in the ninth Bernal started to land his first significant shots around Montero's guard, and both that round and the tenth ended with Montero pinned to the ropes taking punches. The exchange in the tenth appeared to end the fight for all intents and purposes. After ten rounds of gallant fighting, Montero could offer little resistance in the eleventh and the fight was stopped in short order, with Montero suffering a broken jaw.
The Mexican announcers were of the opinion that Bernal needed a knockout to win. The scorecards, however, were all for Bernal, 96-94, 96-94, and 99-95. 99 points for Bernal shouldn't have been possible if he had two taken away from him. Anyway, I know that Arthur Mercante is considered one of the all-time great refs, but I didn't like his performance. Bernal lost two points for hitting low, but he didn't fight any dirtier than Montero did, as the challenger landed some questionable bodyshots and also was guilty of butting. Bit officious there.
Ezzard Charles vs Joe Louis - 15 rounds for the Heavyweight championship.
Round 1 - Louis.
Round 2 - Louis Close.
Round 3 - Charles.
Round 4 - Louis.
Round 5 - Charles.
Round 6 - Charles.
Round 7 - Charles.
Round 8 - Charles.
Round 9 - Charles.
Round 10 - Louis.
Round 11 - Charles.
Round 12 - Charles.
Round 13 - Charles.
Round 14 - Charles.
Round 15 - Charles.
Great and brutal fight between two of the greatest fighters of all time. Shame that Joe wasn't what he was in his prime since you had arguably the greatest heavyweight champion against arguably the greatest light heavyweight of all time.
Nikolai Valuev (44-0 32 KOs) vs Monte Barrett (31-4 17 KOs)
Im skipping the Donald fight because it looks like part of it is missing from YouTube and the John Ruiz 1 fight because of John Ruiz. Barrett is 2-2 in his last 4 but his competition has been pretty good, a wide UD loss to Hasim Rahman, a very close fight with Joe Mesi where both guys were down, and wins over undefeated prospects Owen Beck(24-0) and Dominick Guinn(24-0). The Guinn win was looking pretty good at the time. His other career loses were a close decision to Goofi Lance Whitaker and a pretty brave KO loss to Wlad Klitichsko 6 years previously. Barrett is at this point a pretty good gate keeper type of contender, won't beat the elite, but will sort out the pretenders and give the contenders a tough night (for the most part). This is Valuev's second defense of the title he won off John Ruiz, previously beating Monte Barrett victim Owen Beck by KO.
Barrett going all out on the inside and landing some nice haymakers. But Barrett leaves himself wide open and starts eating Valuev's shots as well and is staggered. Barrett not being really responsible defensively and is paying for it. Good sloppy brawl of a round though
Barrett settles into a rhythm this round of jabbing valuev then moving in with a few body shots and clinching. Both guys exchange overhand rights (more of a straight right for valuev) but other than that jab jab body shits clinch for Barrett
Valuev landing some thudding right hands on Barrett when he comes in. Nice exchange towards the end of the round. It was close but I think Valuev takes it. Barrett also starting to keep his left dangerously low and looking a little tired from all the clinching with a giant
10-9 Valuev (close)
Barrett decides to try to turn this into a slugfest. Barrett is landing a lot of haymakers but he doesn't have the power or size to dent Valuev. Barrett isn't a big puncher and should be trying to box Nikolai. Barrett looks to be fighting to win the battle but not the war
10-9 Barrett (close)
Action slows. Barret's output is down, Valuev begins landing thudding jabs and straight rights. They don't have a lot of snap but they are shots that are wearing down Barrett.
Barrett begins landing more jabs, and well just about anything he throws. Hooks, left uppercuts haymaker rights, all bouncing off of Valuev. Valuev lands a few jabs here and there along with a clubbing right and catches Monte at the end of the round with a nice hook
Ugly nothing round until about 30 seconds left and valuev lands a nice 1-2 combo followed by a right uppercut and hurts Barrett. Barrett stumbles around as the round closes
Valuev being as aggressive as he's been all fight sensing Barrett is hurt and begins landing a lot of shots on Monte. A should be knockdown isn't called as the ropes save Barrett, but that is rectified when Barrett is clubbed to the canvas. Barrett taking a lit of shots and Valuev looks way fresher
Valuev back to his economical self throwing jabs and the clubbing right hand stalking Barrett. Barrett lands some huge left hooks but he's flailing around with exhaustion setting in and Values clubbing shots
Barrett gets flattened by a shot but the ref doesn't call a knockdown. Barrett showing a lot of heart but enough of these thudding shots are landing on him that its wearing him down. Barrett hurt towards the end of the round again as he swings some wild haymakers
Barrett goes down, ruled a slip but then Valuev really winds up and throws a monster hail Mary right hand that lands and puts Barrett down, Barrett gets dropped again from an uppercut, gets up takes a few more shots and there's the towel
Valuev wins KO11
Well, as Steward was saying on commentary Barrett executed a bad game plan. Lots of looping shots and overhands, not even really trying to outbox Valuev more like try to outslug him. I thought Barrett did hurt Nikolai very briefly in round 1 but from there on out it was like Barrett wanted to fight an uphill battle. Valuev for his credit was pretty composed and stuck to his slow clubbing shits to wear out Barrett. I still maintain Joe Louis would rip Values face from his head even with the size dispatity
Merqui Sosa v Tyrone Frazier
I saw this fight out there and I was hoping it would be a decent fight and it was. A good old-fashioned 10 round club-fight.
Round 1: 10-10 Even
Round 2: 10-9 Sosa
Round 3: 10-9 Sosa
Round 4: 10-10 Even
Round 5: 10-9 Frazier
Round 6: 10-9 Sosa
Round 7: 10-9 Sosa
Round 8: 10-9 Sosa
Round 9: 10-9 Sosa
Round 10: Sosa drops and stops Frazier
Total through 9 completed rounds: 89-84 Sosa (actual scores: 90-83, 88-83 and another 88-83 all for Sosa)
I was never a huge fan of Sosa's. I always thought he was awkward and threw awkward punches, but he was effective here. Frazier, of the Philadelphia Fraziers, did not have Uncle Joe's punch, but I will say he threw an excellent left hook to the body. But Sosa was really chopping away those last couple of rounds with his ungainly punches and did some damage to Frazier's nose before it was quite rightly stopped in the 10th. A memory I've always had of Sosa was when my Dad would come over for the fights and ask who was fighting. I recall telling him Merqui Sosa was fighting and him asking me, "Isn't that the fella with the funny legs?" Yep! That's him. Good times.
Ive never seen it, but I might have to watch Toney vs Sosa. Toney listed Sosa as the hardest puncher he fought P4P
PD, I know I saw it live back in the day but for the life of me, I just don't remember. If you check it out let me know if it's worth having another gander at it.
Evander Holyfield v Alex Stewart I
I remember this bout so well. Both fantastic records and I had questions on both. Holyfield was relatively new to the heavies and this would be his first fight with a noted banger and how he would handle the punch. As for Stewart, was he a flash in the pan and how he would do against a real contender. Here we go.
Round 1: 10-9 Holyfield
Round 2: 10-10 Even
Round 3: 10-9 Holyfield
Round 4: 10-10 Even
Round 5: 10-9 Stewart
Round 6: 10-8 Holyfield (battering)
Round 7: 10-9 Holyfield
Round 8: Doctor stops the bout due to the severe cut suffered by Stewart
Total through 7 completed rounds: 69-65 Holyfield (actual scores unknown)
With both undefeated bangers, this fight had me on edge at the time. I will not say Stewart was a flash in the pan because despite his losses he always showed heart and I thought he deserved the decision over Foreman. However, I will say his career never really panned out with some big wins. He always seemed to lose the big one, but always fought well. I had the 2nd round Even although Ferdie Pacheco was on about a great round for Holyfield. Holy stunned Stewart late in the round but Stewart had done very well for 3/4 of the round. I really laughed at the dialogue between Holyfield and Georgie Benton after the 5th round where Stewart was landing haymakers on Holyfield and Holy wasn't ducking or dodging them:
Benton: "Do you know what you're doing?"
Benton: "Well don't do it anymore."
Damn good fight.
Roy Jones Jr also said Merqui was the hardest puncher he faced. And at least one other guy mentioned him in that category, whether he said he was the hardest or one of, I forget who or which he said.
EDIT: It was Frankie Liles, also said he was the hardest.
If Roy and Toney and Liles say you hit hard, you hit hard.
Ezzard Charles v Rex Layne III
I saw a thread from @William Walker who recommended this fight. Didn't know it was out there in its entirety. Here we go scored on California's 11 point system (also known as the Australian 11 pt. system where 11 pts are divided such as 6-5 for the winner of a round, 5.5 each for an Even round and 7-4 for a round with a knockdown)
Round 1: 6-5 Charles
Round 2: 6-5 Layne
Round 3: 5.5-5.5 Even
Round 4: 6-5 Layne
Round 5: 6-5 Layne
Round 6: 7-4 Charles (scores a knockdown)
Round 7: 7-4 Charles (scores a knockdown)
Round 8: 6-5 Charles
Round 9: 6-5 Charles
Round 10: 7-4 Charles (scores a knockdown)
Total: 59.5 - 50.5 Charles (actual scores: 59-51, 59-51 and 60.5-49.5 all for Charles)
To begin, I loved this fight. Also, I've always loved the Ezzard Charles style. He was so relaxed and so Sugar Ray-ish with his punches. Punches that were so fast and so sharp. However, he was a product of his times. Coming up in the era where one had to entertain and had to mix it for the live audience/paying customers. Today, he would be taught to stay on his bike for the 10 rounds, box and potshot against a behemoth like Layne (Ezz was only 187 to Layne's 203). This served Layne well, who was crowding Charles through the first half of the fight very effectively IMO. Even the 8th and 9th I only barely gave to Charles on a couple of close rounds as Layne was once again imposing his heft on Ezz. But Charles' pinpoint shots served him well and he won a good decision in a fight I enjoyed. Again, @William Walker , thanks for bringing this to our attention.
Glad to have brought this to your attention scar. I never would of thought anyone would find it so enjoyable, but it was a good scrap!
Even though I gave Charles 8 rounds, I still find your score feasible. It wasn't until the first KD that Charles really began to dominate Layne.