the what fights did you watch today\scorecard thread.

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Mantequilla, Nov 20, 2009.

  1. scartissue

    scartissue Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Florentino Fernandez v Stefan Redl

    I love these old Madison Square Garden fights. Here we go on the NY rounds basis.

    Round 1: FF
    Round 2: Even
    Round 3: Even
    Round 4: FF
    Round 5: Redl
    Round 6: FF
    Round 7: Fernandez drops and stops Redl

    Total through 6 completed rounds: 3-1-2 Fernandez (actual scores: 4-2, 5-0-1 and 5-1 all for Fernandez)

    To begin, I wasn't sure if this was going to be domination by Floro, but Redl fought a very good fight. He was short and squat, but he fought a very good crowding/counter-punching type of a fight that prevented Floro from unwinding his big gun (the left hook). However, he couldn't do it forever and he finally got caught in the 7th and went down. Strangely, he got up at 9, but just sort of stood there looking at the ref, who had just resumed the fight as Floro came rolling in ready to take his head off. The ref jumped in just before Floro could land anything and stopped the fight. Clearly he wasn't ready to defend himself and it didn't look like Redl griped about it. However, there was one guy in the Redl corner that did gripe and he verbally assaulted the ref, which was audible to the viewer. And I laughed because some things never change. It was a young Lou Duva (Well, he had black hair. I don't know if he was ever young). Again, I always enjoy these old MSG fights.
     
  2. William Walker

    William Walker Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Good one scar. Like this fight.
     
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  3. KO KIDD

    KO KIDD Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    mayorgas antics in this fight were hilarious
     
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  4. scartissue

    scartissue Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Enrique Sanchez v Nestor Garza (super bantamweight title)

    I had seen some activity about this fight recently on another site and thought I would check it out. Sanchez defending his title against Garza. Here we go.

    Round 1: 10-8 Sanchez (scores a knockdown)
    Round 2: 10-9 Sanchez
    Round 3: 10-8 Garza (scores a knockdown)
    Round 4: 10-9 Garza
    Round 5: 10-9 Garza
    Round 6: 10-10 Even
    Round 7: 10-9 Garza
    Round 8: 10-10 Even
    Round 9: 10-9 Garza
    Round 10: 10-9 Garza
    Round 11: 10-9 Garza
    Round 12: 10-9 Garza

    Total: 117-111 Garza (actual scores: 116-111, 115-112 and 114-112 all for Garza)

    I think a couple of these judges as well as the commentating team (I didn't know what they were saying but they did post their card at the end of the fight and they had it a 114-114 draw) were farrrrrrr too generous to Sanchez. I just didn't think he was able to stave off Garza and his heavier shots, which were playing havoc with the features of Sanchez. Indeed, I gotta say, I wouldn't have let Sanchez out for the 12th. With his right eye closed, two cuts over his left eye streaming - and I'm pretty sure his nose was broken in the first round - he was starting to look like Rafael Herrera after the Borkorsor fight. Sanchez (who should not be confused with the Dominican Sanchez who fought Davila for the title) had a nice southpaw jab and sharp combos, but when Garza was on the attack he really pounded Enrique. I really felt I bent over backwards for Sanchez on my score, but clearly others thought it was closer. Man, I was even shouting at the screen in the 8th - which I scored Even - when I felt Sanchez had the round but let Garza back into the fight. It must've been comical seeing me yelling, "Will you fight back! You're letting him back in." Man, I get too involved. Anyways, they fought their hearts out in this one.
     
  5. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    Estrada vs Cuadras

    1:9-10
    2:9-10
    3:9-10
    4:9-10
    5:9-10
    6:10-9
    7:10-9
    8: 10-9
    9: 9-10
    10:10-8
    11:10-9
    12:10-9

    114-113

    Cuadras starts brilliantly and I mean brilliantly here. He's like the second coming of JCC here and works the body furiously. The first 5 rounds are a whitewash and it looks like Estrada is out of his depth.

    But the second half of the fight sees Estrada slow down Cuadras. He outlasts the body work and looks the stronger man as he chips away at Cuadras with huge head shots on the way in.

    The fight is razor close through 12 but Estrada wins it by virtue of a knockdown last on.

    What a war.
     
  6. George Crowcroft

    George Crowcroft 'Snarky Little Gobshite' - IntentionalButt Full Member

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    Estrada is the man. Absolutely beast and a brilliant technician. By chance, I watched his fight with Rommel Asenjo not twenty minutes ago. Not much here other than a short feeling out process and an absolute pasting. I absolutely love his lead hand and he pierced through Asenjo's guard and set up both his cross and his hook to the body; uppercut upstairs. It was just a blistering offensive performance.
     
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  7. scartissue

    scartissue Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Shane Mosley v Ricardo Mayorga I

    Round 1: 10-9 Mayorga
    Round 2: 10-9 Mayorga
    Round 3: 10-9 Mayorga
    Round 4: 10-9 Mosley
    Round 5: 10-10 Even
    Round 6: 10-9 Mosley
    Round 7: 10-9 Mayorga
    Round 8: 10-9 Mayorga
    Round 9: 10-9 Mayorga
    Round 10: 10-9 Mosley
    Round 11: 10-9 Mosley
    Round 12: Mosley drops Mayorga twice and stops him.

    Total through 11 completed rounds: 106-104 Mayorga (actual scores: 105-104 Mayorga, and a 105-104, 107-102 both for Mosley)

    I agree with the announcers that this was about the best I ever saw Mayorga. Until he started to unravel in the 12th he showed terrific stamina and aggression. The scores were a little funky (Harold Lederman also scored it like one of the judges at 107-102 for Mosley) but that was due to perception more than anything. Were you more impressed with Shane's, short punches-on-the-way-in or Mayorga's wild shots? One does have to determine how legal some of those wild shots were and the work-rate being delivered. Suffice to say it was out of the hands of the judges as Shane lowered the boom spectacularly in the 12th.
     
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  8. scartissue

    scartissue Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Luf, thanks for the heads up on this one. Here is how I had it.

    Juan Francisco Estrada v Carlos Cuadras I

    Round 1: 10-10 Even
    Round 2: 10-9 Cuadras
    Round 3: 10-9 Cuadras
    Round 4: 10-9 Cuadras
    Round 5: 10-9 Cuadras
    Round 6: 10-9 Estrada
    Round 7: 10-9 Estrada
    Round 8: 10-9 Estrada
    Round 9: 10-9 Cuadras
    Round 10: 10-8 Estrada (scores a knockdown)
    Round 11: 10-10 Even
    Round 12: 10-10 Even

    Total: 115-115 Draw (actual scores: 114-113 by all 3 judges for Estrada and I believe a 114-113 for Cuadras by Harold Lederman)

    Good, tough fight by both combatants and one which the judge has to scrutinize carefully. Cuadras throws a lot of punches, but many are of the shoe-shine variety that land on arms and gloves. Many do get through and that's what one needs to watch. Estrada, on the other hand, is very conservative and choosy about the punches he throws. Every one he throws just about lands and with impact. However, he just doesn't throw a lot. Understandable at 35 years old, which is very old for the little guys, who are really based on speed and assortment. Luf, I like your 8th and 9th rounds. You saw them like I did as opposed to Harold and the announcing team who were on about how Cuadras turned it around in the 8th. I said to myself, "Wait, what?!" And re-watched the 8th in case I got complacent. But no, I wasn't. Estrada clearly had that round IMO. But it's in the eye of the beholder. Damn good fight and the fact that we all had it down to the wire tells you we were all watching the same fight.
     
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  9. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    Absolutely. I think Estrada was always the superior technician, he just had to work, to slow Cuadras down. But once he did that, the fight was going one way imo.
     
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  10. George Crowcroft

    George Crowcroft 'Snarky Little Gobshite' - IntentionalButt Full Member

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    If haven't seen them, Scar, Estrada has more awesome fights. Namely the Cuadras rematch (which I thought was better than this one); Rungvisai I and Chocolatito I & II.

    The Sanchez fights are good too, but hard to find.
     
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  11. scartissue

    scartissue Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Thanks, George. I saw the others but not the Estrada rematch. Will be checking that out soon.
     
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  12. Young Terror

    Young Terror ★ Griselda ★ Full Member

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    Estrada is 31 not 35 but it seems hes been going for so long ppl think hes older.
     
  13. scartissue

    scartissue Boxing Addict Full Member

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    YT, good catch. I thought I heard Lampley saying he was 35. I should have checked.
     
  14. scartissue

    scartissue Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Kid Gavilan v Ralph (Tiger) Jones I (NY scoring)

    Thanks @William Walker for bringing this fight up on another thread.

    Round 1: Jones
    Round 2: Even
    Round 3: Jones
    Round 4: Gavilan
    Round 5: Gavilan
    Round 6: Gavilan
    Round 7: Gavilan
    Round 8: Gavilan
    Round 9: Gavilan
    Round 10: Gavilan

    Total: 7-2-1 Gavilan (actual scores: 7-3, 6-4 and 5-4-1 all for Gavilan)

    William, I checked your score after I watched and tallied mine and it was pretty eerie. We had the exact score with only rounds 2 and 3 inverted. That was good scoring seeing as how there were some very close rounds here. Regarding the fight, Jones could have exerted himself here a bit more IMO. There were so many times his heavier poundage could have shifted ones opinion on a close round, but I thought he laid back a bit too much and let the flamboyance of Gavilan eat those rounds. Gavilan really was more than just a fighter. He was an entertainer who could fight. His colorful bolos really played to the crowd. Some landed but many landed on Tiger's shoulders and such, but it brought the screams from the crowd. It was a good telecast and it was cool seeing Nat Fleischer at ringside.
     
  15. William Walker

    William Walker Boxing Addict Full Member

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    As always @scartissue, I'm always glad to see a good one, let others know about it to people that enjoy it as well.

    I think your description is spot on. Our close scorecards do seem so uncanny considering how close many of the rounds were, like you said. I also have to agree with you about Jones holding back. He was able to fight comfortably and keep the fight close even as laid back as he was, but he was just too tired and passive in those last three rounds, largely why he lost the fight in my opinion.
    I think that the ultimate difference between Jones and Gavilan is also as you say. Jones was merely a great boxer, Gavilan was a great boxer as well as a great entertainer, and that's why Gavilan won. That's why I rate Gavilan so highly. To me he's up there with Larry Holmes and Evander Holyfield. He was brimming with boxing talent, and could easily win that way, but was extremely prone to getting dragged into brutal wars, often by his own initiative.

    Boy, I just love the heck out of this fight.
     
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