I'm sory but Jackson being a greater fighter of all-time over Mirko? It renders this whole thing null and void in my eyes. That and Couture over Hendo makes me really wonder. It seems to be voters are UFC based.
The Couture over Hendo isnt wrong bro its really close man it can go either way. I suppose its the P4P thing and the great thing is both guys have competed in mutiple weights. Of course we know Randy is the 3 time Heavyweight Champ and was very successful at 205 destroying 3 World Champions in their primes. What ive always thought was cool about Henderson is he beat Carlos Newton(UFC Welterweight Champion),Murilo Bustamante(UFC Middleweight Champion),Vitor Belfort(UFC Light Heavyweight),Wanderlei Silva(Pride Light Heavyweight),Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira(UFC/Pride Heavyweight Champion). Im sure you catch where im going Dans just a P4P badass. Hes so accomplished so much winning the Brazil Open,UFC 17 ?,Pride Welterweight tourney,Rings tourney. Only man to hold to Pride titles. Imagine if he had unified with Rampage and Silva he could arguablly go down as the best ever. However he didnt but you gotta respect his tougness and willigness to say ok lets find who is the best at these weight classes I didnt see Gomi or Fedor coming to the UFC. Whats wrong with Rampage over Cro Cop. Cro Cops a great fighter but what helps Ramage is hes actually won a World Championship techniqually 2 of them if you count the Pride belt over Henderson. Give me 2 wins over Chuck Liddell,Dan Henderson,Lindland,Arona,Bustamante,Ninja,Igor,Randleman theres 5 Champs if you count Ninjas Elite XC belt with I understand if you dont. Cro Cops resume is impressive of course Josh Barnett 3 times,Wanderlei Silva,Coleman,Randleman,Fujita,Sakuraba,Herring,Igor. Its really close man but to some people the 2 wins of Chuck Liddell and dominant wins at that are more impressive then anything Cro Cop has done plus he was the first unified Champ. You gotta really look strong at the Liddell wins remember hes the only man to beat him twice he succeeded where Couture and Horn failed miserably hell good fighters like Tito and Babalu where beat down in both fights vs Liddell while Rampage made him look like he belonged in the amateur shows in the middle of nowhere. Plus the 2nd win ended that incredible run Liddell was on KO 2 Ortiz,KO 1 White,KO 1 Couture,KO 4 Horn,KO 2 Couture,KO 1 Babalu,KO 3 Ortiz. Its all about who you beat man IMO.
Some results I dislike are Faber over Tito,Shogun over Frank Shamrock,Rampage over Liddell,GSP over Couture. Is this thing about who would actually win the fights ? Cause thats what is looks like who would win if weight werent a factor but that doesnt prove who the greatest fighter ever is. Shogun over Shamrock is stupid and I hate Frank but its how I feel listen Shogun is a great fighter but his career is mostly built off that 4 month Middleweight tournament in 2005. Frank Shamrock is a guy whos fought for the better part of the last 15 years and has won titles basically wherever he went UFC,Pancrase,Strikeforce,WEC. Rutten,Ortiz,Horn,Funaki ETC Franks a great fighter id pick Shogun to **** him but accomplishment wise its no contest. Urijah Faber over Tito Ortiz WTF did these guys just get born in the last 12 months ? Faber is a fantastic athelte and hes been doing well as Featherweight WEC Champ but arguablly the guys best wins are vs faded UFC veterans one who never could beat the elite anyway (Jeff Curran) IMO Fabers toughest opponet was Tyson Griffin who stopped him. Tito Ortiz on the other hand still is tied for the record of most consecutive title defenses and carried the UFC in his back hes beat a whos whos list Mezger,Ken Shamrock 3x,Wanderlei Silva,Forrest Griffin,Patrick Cote,Vitor Belfort,Evan Tanner and Vladimir Matshuenko. Faber cant touch that in any way. Rampage we know has beat Liddells ass 2 times but most his career is built off those wins although hes got a few other nice ones. But overall depth to a resume Chuck Liddell may have the best of all times. Jeff Monson,Kevin Randleman,Vitor Belfort,Wanderlei Silva,Randy Couture 2x,Tito Ortiz 2x,Babalu 2x,Murlio Bustamante,Guy Mezger,Alistair Overeem. How in the hell is Rampage a all time greater fighter ? GSP has a fabulous resume extremly deep and so is Coutures but what sets Couture on a different level at the moment is this guy was actually a true Champ and defended his titles succesfully. GSP until he starts doing that has no claim to Randys spot.
I disagree on Tito, jimmie. Mezger is a mental case; talented, but uneven. It's a good win, but not outstanding. Shamrock was a faded version of Ortiz; a one dimensional fighter who was losing the war with time. Silva is a good win; but I don't think Wandy had reached his peak yet by that point. He lost to Griffin, IMO. Still, for a "great" fighter, he shouldn't have had it that close against a game but mentally unsure fighter. It's a fact that Griffin went into that fight, less than 100% sure that he even belonged there. Cote is a good win... over a blown up middleweight. We know about the ups and downs of Belfort; a good win, but not great. Evan Tanner was a blown up middleweight; a solid win, but nothing more. At 185, this is a MUCH closer fight. I'll give him the Vlad fight; good win. I feel that Liddell was taking care of the toughest challengers to Tito's title, while Tito took on the best of what was left. Once he got in there with Liddell and Couture, he didn't just lose - he got steamrolled. It's no shame to lose to either guy, but to get outclassed is indicative of what I've always thought, that Tito's hype and personality, made him more memorable than his actual accomplishments - good enough but not great. I'd still take him over Faber, just because Faber simply hasn't done enough - but aside from the loss to Griffin (who's a naturally bigger guy), he's never really come close to losing. He'll have to sustain that kind of dominance, but his record isn't that bad.
Ok yeah his wins have flaws to them but who really cant you do that with ? Every fighter will have something to them like a injury going in,maybe a age thing,it was close ETC. Faber P4P with his striking skills and fast pace id consider better then Ortiz but resume wise he cant match him yet. Im just not sure how that thing works its to determine the best ever but I feel like they are picking who would win in a fight where weight doesnt matter. I go off resumes when deciding whos great.
Using a resume is necessary and very important... but I place more emphasis on styles. Tito's greatest success lies against guys who were made to be defeated by a GnP strategy. Outside of that, Tito's weaknesses as a fighter are glaring. Faber's resume needs more depth, but imagine his athletic ability and variety of skills at 205 - against a poor boxing, weak defensed fighter who'd have to beat him on the ground to defeat him. Faber was pulling crap on a skilled fighter like Curran that the Frog had no defense against. What would Tito do in a situation like that?
Yeah like ive mentioned when I imagine Faber as a bigger verison agianst Ortiz I think he smokes him as we know Titos entire game is shoot for the double leg get it into guard,grab behind the neck and push forward to the cage and just throw elbows without attempting to pass. Tito aside from the Matshuenko fight always had difficulties with good wrestlers Liddell,Evans somewhat,Couture. Faber could take this fight to the ground and pull his own GNP watching Tito in some fights like the Evans,Machida,Couture fights when he gets taken down hard hes be open to be smacked around a bit if you notice. Also Faber would pick him apart on the feet ive seen Tito train I dont believe his striking is bad but he doesnt seem to have confidence in it when he gets inside the octagon hes to afraid of getting hit. I think Tito Ortiz has the ability to be or atleast did have the ability to be a better fighter then he was. Instead of his basic shoot from 20 feet away style id like to see him use his Thai Clinch as its an effective weapon for him and suits him so he can use the strength and size advantages he has at 205. I also like to see him use his submission game more ive seen the 2001 ADCC tournaments and he looked great pulling of the North-South choke which is incredibly hard for me so I respect him for that and I thought he pulled it out vs Arona.
The voting is very American based, so there really is no point in even participating. Until we get more international participation, those things mean jack ****.
