Tokyo Douglas vs. '92/235Lb Bowe

IDK who would have won but

Douglas has wins over Tyson, McCall, Collier, Page, Berbick, Cobb, Mike Williams, Dick Ryann.

Along with his losses Douglas faced 1 of the (10) best oppositions faced by a HW ("with a winning record") ever, and won most of them.

 

Yes I totally agree. The groomed fighter with the house on his side gets the breaks. The Mathis fight, the Donnald incident, maybe the Tubbs decision all could have been so different. Having said that a groomed fighter can argue that he can't affored a hiccup because the exposure is higher and presure is on from day one. But isn't that more reason to be focussed?

Sometimes I feel fighters like Douglas are around all the time. Waiting in the shadows, waiting for the right break and right set of circumstances to allow them to achieve some kind of potential before their title shot as Buster was able to. Fighters like that were always talented but are left treading water waiting for phone calls whilst dropping fights they should win on the road.

Douglas showed quite a lot of focus in that run between Tucker and Tyson. Those rounds were excelent prep.

 

This New jersey blah-blah.How can you create this?
i think this New Jersey blah-blah can't save the first round ko loss by Savarese.
Douglas couldn't beat Tangstad.This fight was in Chicago.
Mike White knocked Douglas out for example.I know this fight was in New Jersey also.
And where are your brain?

 

Especially the Collier win shows Douglas' greatness.It was very impressive.
Bravo you convinced me.Douglas is the most talented athlete ever.
I changed my mind .Thank you for this Collier thing! It was the most important
thing in the sport history.

 

That's the big problem with those heavies that blow hot and cold---which guy shows up? And I think both of these guys blow hot and cold.

I know the overall career numbers are quite different, but I guess I look at things a little differently.

As in the case of Bowe---he was far more vulnerable to a loss in some of his fights than his record indicates. The guy in the ring with Tubbs or Coetzer or Biggs was lucky to not have been facing another guy that night. A more dangerous opponent instead and I think there are losses.

Like you said, he couldn't afford to stumble. So matchmaking was more crucial. And I'm sure instead of fighting a more worthy opponent than a Coetzer, we would have seen another guy of similar ilk and a style suited to Riddick---like say an Alex Stewart. Joe Hipp. Or other guys ranked in that 5-15 range he seemed to feast on.

I think the only top 5 fighters he ever faced were Evander and Pierre. How Coetzer was ranked #1 is a joke and I think he loses to 6 or 8 guys back then.

As to the fight, I think Buster turns him. And Riddick would be forced to chase after him to land. But the other guy had a much better jab and the ability to throw while sliding over a step. I just don't see it missing much.

A crucial part of the fight would be Buster's ability to weather a storm. Can he? If so, I think he wins the rounds by outlanding him. And he isn't stopping Bowe. I think if he's way ahead in the fight, he gets up or weathers that storm. A back and forth bout or one where the other guy is coming on strong--like Tucker fight--I think he would concede defeat.

A tough match for both guys. I just like Bowe a lot more against smaller opponents and guys he doesn't have to chase. Guys with automatic openings if you will & not the guys he has to create an opening for himself.

 

Douglas was always talented but lazy and dissilusioned from day one. He took fights that he could get and not as many were so handpicked.

David Bey knocked Douglas out fair and square but Bey was a knockout specialist in his home town having his debut. Douglas was only 5-0 himself and already having his second fight outside of his home state.

Tangstead benefited from points being taken away from Douglas - that's the only reason why Tangstad (based in Chicago at that time) got a draw in that fight....In Chicago.

Douglas most likely was knocked out fair and square by Mike the Giant White but White was a giant, Douglas was winning a shutout until the stoppage. Those big guys can knock you out or wear you down just falling on top of you.

Douglas, when still unknown, beat Tex Cobb with three days notice. Cobb had only lost to world champions. Cobb, on a win streak since the Holmes fight, knew he was in for a fight that night because he was suposed to be fighting Trevor Berbick who was unbeaten that year. Interestingly Berbick pulled out of a Cobb fight and took an easier fight with trial horse Walter santemore days later. Douglas wound up beating Cobb who Berbick ducked.

Page was having a cross roads fight after losing his title to Tubbs. Page needed the win. One fight before he was a champion. Douglas was brought in as the opponent and did a number on Page.

Altogether Douglas fought five unbeaten opponent's within a year of turning pro. He was proberbly booked as a losing opponent a lot of times but won fights on the road. Mike Williams was suposed to beat him. Cobb was supposed to beat him. Page was supposed to beat him. McCall was suposed to beat him. Tyson was suposed to beat him. Berbick was supposed to beat him yet Buster turned them all over.

Tucker was about the only rated guy expected to beat Douglas who actually did.

 

I think it could have been a good fight if both men showed up well prepared. But my money would have to go on Riddick Bowe who was a bit more consistent, stable, and Douglas's superior in the physical department.

 

When Bowe gets outboxed he resorts to his physicality and punching power, just
as Lewis. However Bowe makes for an cruder display. Buster may very well outclass
Bowe for long stretches, just a matter of time before Bowe walks him down and gets the KO. This is Bowe after he got a boxing lesson from Tubbs and Biggs.

 

Buster Douglas. He wouldnt fight Bowes fight and keep him on the end of his jab and use his superior footwork to take Bowe to school. But just like against Tyson, Douglas needs to be wary of that uppercut, a punch we know Bowe can deliver really well.

The way i see the fight going is, Bowe throws a jab, walking forward, looking to mix it, Douglas jabbing back, using feinting, twisting, turning Bowe, not giving him a chance to get off and basically winning the exchanges by getting in and out of there quickly. Its the later rounds which will be interesting, with Douglas ahead, can Bowe cover lost ground? we can never doubt Bowes heart/determination, so he may end up getting a stoppage late in the fight while being behind on the scorecards, or does Douglas have the discipline to see it through?

The closest thing to a Douglas type fighter who Bowe fought was Golota and he troubled Bowe alot. Think about the Tubbs and Biggs fights as well.

Bowe didnt do too well against boxers.

And Douglas (Tokyo) was better than the best version of Golota

For those calling Douglas a bum, what was Bowe then?

Oh right, he beats Holyfield.....gets fat, beats a handful of decent-good fighters, gets manhandled by Golota and hes an ATG?


If Douglas is a bum, so is Bowe because they have a lot in common. Bowe is just another Buster Douglas, probably better managed with a bit more desire and heart.

But skills wise, Douglas was the much better boxer

 

It might boil down to if Riddick is in good enough shape to use his legs to be able to track the guy down late. Waist up isn't the problem. It's the feet set to hit this guy. Douglas isn't going to walk in until or if Bowe gets hurt bad. If Bowe has been absorbing most of the fight, I just don't think any springs are in those legs. At age 25 no less. The wear and tear will cause him to lose a half a step late in the fight. He can't afford it against this guy who has a much better set of wheels than Golata.

Bowe couldn't catch Donald either and followed him instead of cutting off the ring. I think he needs to get Douglas to the ropes or cut the ring off. And try throwing a straight right hand instead of that looping one. A straight right catches Douglas late. I'm not sure a looping shot can catch Douglas clean enough to do the trick.

It's an interesting bout. And throwing Douglas' name in the hat with a Ruddock back then would have been nice to see as well. I was big on Evander handling Buster though. I thought he was the worst guy for Buster and a Foreman or a Holmes/Morrison/Mercer/etc could have made for better opponents for Buster.

That Holyfield ko loss was so devastating.

 

This is how I see it too.

 

Yes, Holyfeild was razor sharp and totally focussed and made a fat Douglas look so much worse than he was. Douglas did not help himself, his lagacy or his cause one bit in that shape but I don't knock evander for taking care of business. Buster should have shown the undisputed title more respect.

However, this mystical match up is about primes and comparing a focussed punch perfect version of Douglas on his best night. A rare sight I agree but even Douglas on winning nights after 1987 I think Douglas was comparable to a lot of Bowes winning performances outside of his best night against Evander.

 

I def gotta check out some more Douglass fights. I got into the 80s guys late.
So Douglass, Pinky Thomas, Tucker, Tillis etc I need to find the time to watch more full
fights. Agree about the footwork though. Bowe will need to get some inside work in on
the clinches. Let's not underestimate Futch. If he could diffuse Ali, I believe he can
get Bowe's jab pumping as well. Yes Bowe's only shot at a KO is against the ropes late.
Maybe like round 12 if Buster gets tired for a second.

 

Douglas, a bum that got knocked out by a man making his pro debut is going to beat Riddick Bowe??

I think people in this thread have gone cuckoo.

 

Yep.

That's the one big factor I always always liked about Evander Holyfield. When he was the guy getting his heavyweight title shot, he was going to be 100%. He was going to prove everyone wrong and put forth a career best night. Kind of like Holmes--Ali in a way. One guys's best night but the opponent sure didn't show up with his. But razor sharp and in great shape and focused for the big night.

Man, it seems like a long time since we've seen anyone other than a Klitschko do a ton of pre-fight preparations. And when that opening was there, that window opened. Evander capitalized in a nano second. Douglas not landing his jab so he goes to an uppercut from way on the outside. Bang.

I knew that was it for Buster. All over. He went to penny stock status overnight.

We like these mythical matches allright, but we don't suffer the consequences of a devastating loss. And it very well could effect the lives of 15 people, not just the fighter.