I rewatched both fights recently and came up with the following results: Toney - Griffin I (114-113) (3,4,6,8,9,12 for Toney; round 3 (2point round) Toney - Griffin II (116-112) The 2nd fight was a clear win for Toney. The 1st fight was closer and Griffin did better than expected. But still, when you take the emotions out of it, Toney deserved the nod in my view.
When I think about Toney vs Griffin I think of Toney sitting in his corner spitting blood, and on d times when Toney's trips down wer ruld ez slips.
I've a watched these fight a number of times and came to the same conclusion that Toney got robbed. Though Griffin held his own and gave Toney some trouble in both fights I feel Toney out boxed him and landed the much cleaner more damaging shots throughout. I've scored them in the passed can't quite remember my scores but I had Toney winning both fights by a few rounds.
I watched these fights WAY back and thought Toney was robbed also and when I voiced my opinion most of my friends said I was absolutely wrong and that Griffin deserved the wins. Im glad to finally see Im not the only one.
That is the way I saw it also. In terms of landed punches, they were pretty even but Toney's blows were of better quality.
I had Toney-Griffin II a 5-5-2 draw. I felt like I was watching a different fight than the HBO team at times, especially in the early rounds. Griffin was spinning Toney and landing some clean, flush punches and they were describing the action as if they were just worthless arm punches. They also gave Toney way too much credit for his jabs.The scorecards were too wide (especially the 11-1 card) but I didn't think that Toney put all that many rounds in the bag decisively. He got outboxed for large parts of the fight.
I basically agree - I thought Toney landed more eye-catching individual punches, but was very selective in his output while Griffin was busier w/ his. I felt the 1st fight followed a similar pattern, except it was a more spirited fight & each fighter deserved credit for a KD. I also thought HBO's team was biased towards Toney in both fights & overemphasized his work while downplaying or ignoring Griffin's.
Here's how I scored them: James Toney vs Montell Griffin I Round 1 10-9 Griffin Round 2 9-10 Toney Round 3 9-10 Toney Round 4 10-9 Griffin Round 5 9-10 Toney Round 6 9-10 Toney Round 7 10-9 Griffin Round 8 9-10 Toney Round 9 9-10 Toney Round 109-10 Toney Round 1110-9 Griffin Round 1210-9 Griffin 115-113 James Toney James Toney vs Montell Griffin II Round 1 10-9 Toney Round 2 10-9 Griffin Round 3 10-9 Griffin Round 4 9-10 Toney Round 5 9-10 Toney Round 6 9-10 Toney Round 7 10-9 Griffin (close) Round 8 9-10 Toney Round 9 9-10 Griffin Round 10 9-10 Toney Round 11 10-9 Toney Round 12 10-9 Griffin 115-113James Toney Both close fights but I think Toney edged both honestly thought first fight was clearer then second which was way closer but that's just my opinion Tony was constantly landing the better shots in both but Griffin was more active though most of his shots didn't land clean
I was going to write my thoughts but you did it for me. I also re-watched the two matches in the last few months and both times I had Toney winning after a close fight. No robbery here in my opinion but both times it was a bit more Toney than Griffin.
I was watching one of them not too long ago and still thought Toney lost, (close). It would be interesting to watch them both again a little more closely. My memory of those fights is James lost his footing after the Jones loss, and was no longer getting the benefit of close decisions.
I checked the stats. Actually, Toney threw and landed more punches in both fights. Out goes the notion that Griffin was busier.
Pretty much feel the same… Montell Griffin was no slouch, good fighter, Futch rated him and trained him.
Regardless of who you thought won, James should have KO'ed him. Had he really jumped on him, Griffin would not have lasted the distance. James was extremely talented, but did not like to exert himself. He may have even won those fights landing the cleaner shots and blocking what Griffin was throwing, but he made the fight appear close and made it more difficult than it needed to be.
I don't think Toney did enough in the later rounds in both fights and gave away the fights. James Toney vs Montel Griffin 1 1 Griffin 2 Griffin 3 Toney 4 Toney 5 Toney 6 Toney 7 Griffin 8 Toney 9 Griffin 10 Griffin 11 Griffin 12 Griffin Griffin 115-113 So the general feeling is that Toney was hard done by in the Griffin fights but i actually felt Toney legitimately lost this fight. He was too casual for me and didn't show enough urgency, especially in the later rounds in which Griffin to my eyes stole the rounds with the more flashy work and appearing to want it more than Toney. The biggest talking point in this fight is rounds 3 and 7 both fighters were wobbled by single punches..... Griffin almost went down from a right hand in the 3rd and was all over the place and to me it appeared to be a knockdown. Then Toney was wobbled in the 7th and fell back into the ropes with only the ropes holding him up. So it appeared to me 2 legitimate knockdowns may of been missed. Overall it was a decent technical fight nothing special but decent, Toney landed the harder punches the issue was he allowed the smaller man to back him too much and steal rounds from him just by being the aggressor. Griffin showed a good jab and actually outjabbed Toney and whilst Griffin's punches didn't have much oomph in them i liked his aggression and workrate more. Toney is so frustrating to watch if he would've just lifted the pace a bit more it was a winnable fight for him, but he was far too casual for my liking and he let the smaller man outhustle him. James Toney vs Montel Griffin 2 1 Toney 2 Griffin 3 Griffin 4 Toney 5 Toney 6 Griffin 7 Toney 8 Toney 9 Griffin 10 Griffin 11 Toney 12 Griffin 114-114 Draw Toney did slightly better in the rematch he seemed to be more active with the jab and targeted the body of Griffin with the jab also. Griffin was pretty much the same awkward/slippery and trying to go to Toney's left to create punching angles. But yet again just like the 1st fight Toney didn't press enough in the later rounds when he really could've stamped his authority on the fight. His corner pleaded with him to go all out in the 12th round but he did virtually nothing in the round letting Griffin dance around him and get a free round. A few things to note about this fight..... Lederman's scorecard and the HBO team were way off on this fight they seemed to suggest Toney won this fight handily that is complete nonsense and Lederman's scorecard of 117-111 is ridiculous. But saying that one of the judges scorecards was even worse in actual fact it might be one of the worst scorecard's i've ever seen 119-109 to Griffin ? what in the world was he watching ? But all in all another decent tactical fight but Toney yet again didn't press enough in the later rounds.
