Tony Canzoneri as a pound-for-pound great

I have Canzi in the top 7. Only Greb, Fitz, Ross, Armstrong, Walker, and maybe Ezzard Charles perhaps rank over Canzi. Thinking about it, Cazi could be in the top 6th of all time.

 

What about Robinson?

 

Well Robinson never jump up as high in weight as the guys above mention, and win. He did it one time vs Maxie, and lost. Even if he was in the lead before he thown in the towel. He never attempted to do it again. Guys like Fitz, Walker, Greb, and Charles jump all the way up to heavyweight from welter or middleweight and beating the top contenders or in the case of Fitz or Charles, winning the title. Cani made a similer jump in welterweight. Also holding the 3 titles to Robinson's 2, makes Cani a bit higher on my list. These guys are the true pound for pounders.

 

I agree. Good review of the facts. Damned impressive record. I have seen footage of this man box. He was very talented and tough as nails.

 

canzoneri and arguello should both rank above pep, they were lineal featherweight champs that proved to be worldclass at 135/140. Canzoneri is top 10 of all times at lightweight, can pep say this, nope.

 

#21 for me. It's certainly arguable that he should be higher.

 

If moving up the weights succesfully is your criteria for p4p greatness then sure they should. If in the ring dominance, h2h ability, level of opposition, consistency etc. are involved, it becomes more questionable.

No doubt Canzoneri has some great scalps to his name and did fight competitively with greats above his natural weight which says a lot for him.

Brownpimp, let me ask you this, do you have your own p4p list? You always seem keen on commenting on others' and telling us where certain fighters should be placed and who should be above who. I'd like to see your list if you have one.

 

Each time I look at how efficiently Canzi dropped and decisioned the energetic Ambers to recapture the LW Title in 1935, I wonder how well he might have done against the version of Armstrong that Ambers later put through hell before Hank was able to join Fitz, Canzi and Ross as triple crown champions. Tony peaked when he prevented Billy Petrolle from ever becoming a champion in 1932, and it may have been fortunate for Barney Ross that he wasn't Canzi's challenger on that particular evening.

Canzi sometimes blew hot and cold, as might be expected of anybody who stepped into the ring 175 times. But he was not stopped in his first 174 efforts, and at his absolute best, may have been a top five ATG.

 

1. Ray Robinson
2. Sam Langford
3. Harry Greb
4. Henry Armstrong
5. Muhammad Ali
6. Ezzard Charles
7. Roberto Duran
8. Ray Leonard
9. Joe Louis
10.Carlos Monzon
11. Benny Leonard
12. Pernell Whitaker
13. Archie Moore
14. Marvin Hagler
15. Joe Gans
16. Mickey Walker
17. George Dixon
18. barbados Joe walcott
19. Barney Ross
20. Tony Canzoneri
21. Eder Jofre
22. Alexis Arguello
23. Willie Pep
24. Sandy Saddler
25. Carlos Ortiz
26. Gene Tunney
27. Kid Gavilan
28. Emile Griffith
29. Ike Williams
30. Jack Johnson
31. Julio Cesar Chavez
32. Charley Burley
33. Evander Holyfield
34. Larry Holmes
35. Dick Tiger
36. Michael Spinks
37. Roy Jones Jr.
38. Abe Attell
39. Jimmy Mclarnin
40. Panama Al Brown
41. Manuel Ortiz
42. Fighting Harada
43. Floyd Mayweather
44. Bernard Hopkins
45. Wilfredo Gomez
46. Thomas Hearns
47. Aaron Pryor
48. Ricardo Lopez
49. Sammy Angott
50. Vicente Saldivar

 

I dont see how some one would put Caniz outside of the top ten for winning 3 titles at 3 differnt weights. At the time very FEW fighters were able to pull that off.

 

You sure do like white fighters, don't you?

 

its a white fighter that beat black fighter kid chocolate.

 

I wasn't just making a reference to Canzoneri, I was making a reference to all of Dempsey's favorites and most of his highest rated fighters being white. He says he rates on how high they jump in weight, while for the most part, leaving out fighters with better resumes like Robinson. If so, why not include Roy Jones, Floyd Mayweather, etc if it's all about how you jump in weight?

And what I really don't get is, if it's about jumping in weight and resume combined, how the hell does he leave out someone like Langford and Walcott? I rank both above Fitzsimmons.

And how do you rate Ross above Armstrong? He makes a big deal out of Ross being better because he was the first one to actually win titles in 3 weight classes simultaneously. Not realizing that Ross jumped from 135 to 147, while Armstrong jumped from 126 to 147, while defending the WW title 19 times, and should've won 4 titles in 4 weight classes if not for the robbery against Garcia at MW. I think Armstrong's accomplishments clearly outshine Ross's.

 

i actually forgot to include fitzsimmons in my top 50, then again lol, which great did he beat? Corbett and gardner,. Jack 'nonpariel' dempsey really didnt beat anyone either.

I always felt whitaker could have pulled a henry armstrong at 160 if he would have fought quincy taylor or lonnie bradley. 1995-1997 is when that division went down the toilet, it would have been the perfect time for whitaker to do it.