Top 10 greatest middleweight contenders ever

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Jel, Nov 25, 2019.


  1. Clinton

    Clinton Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    And if you're ever back in NYC, there is a great jazz/supper club called Smoke on Broadway between 105 and 106 Streets. Superb bands there
     
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  2. mcvey

    mcvey Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Cheers Id like to visit again , I loved the town.Maybe I can combine it with a fight at the MSG or Barclays ,I saw Frampton v Santa Cruz at the Barclays centre, excellent arena.
     
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  3. Clinton

    Clinton Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I was at that fight too. See ya at the next one!!!!!
     
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  4. mcvey

    mcvey Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Plenty of guys deserve to be in front of Papp,imo
    Shade
    Bolden
    Wade
    Towne
    Burley
    Lytell
    Yarosz
    McAvoy
    Harvey
    Booker
    Chase
    Marshall
    Belloise
    Sands
    Richards
    Lausse
    Carter
    Benton
    Basora
    Tunero
    To name just a few.
     
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  5. mcvey

    mcvey Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    If I come over I'll give you a heads up,then maybe we can meet in Jimmy's Corner Bar or the Irish pub off Times Sq?
     
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  6. Clinton

    Clinton Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Love BOTH those places. 10 minute subway ride from my flat. You got it!!!
     
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  7. Ra's Al-Ghul

    Ra's Al-Ghul The one and only! Full Member

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    Well you try again to re-write history, in the hope we don't check it: Jones had won against a in 20 fight undefeated boxer in the last but one fight before and only lost against decent opposition like a 30 - 3 - 2 contender, with whom he draw two bouts previous. While 34 isn't old for a middleweight by any meanings. Hopkins had not even reached his peak at that age.

    Torres was not in the same division as professional, nor was Mazzinghi. Downes youself named a no-hopper and second tier boxer, Moyer and Fernandez were even worse, while Mims and Boyd only know you and your gang.

    You know as me it was a political reason why Papp didn't fight Giardello; who's opposition had probabbly combinated many more defeats, but even failed against them often. He was the top contender and was obligated for a mandatory defence.
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2019
  8. scartissue

    scartissue Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Now who can argue with that!
     
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  9. Cecil

    Cecil Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Well, I think you probably emphasised my point there!
     
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  10. mcvey

    mcvey Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Jones had won just 1 of his last 6 fights.True ? or False?
    The guy he beat was Duane Horsman who never in his career beat a ranked fighter,
    or indeed a fighter of any real class,he was a journeyman. True? or False?

    Jones at 34 was having his last fight. True ?or False?

    Jones was last ranked in1958 when he was number 10.He fought Papp in1962 4 years later. True ? or False?

    Torres was ranked number 9 in the middleweight division in1963 He had a total of45 fights,32 of them were at middle weight.Among those he beat at that weight were.McClure,Gonzalez,D Fullmer,Paret .True ? or False?

    Mazzinghi was ranked at middleweight for 5 straight years!
    1963 no6, 1964 no5,1965 no7,1966 no 1,1967 no3.
    He beat Scott,Cassidy,Gonzalez,Hernandez,Brennan,D Fullmer
    True ? or False?

    Fernandez was the only man to ko Jose Torres. True ? or False?

    Boyd beat Mims,Beecham,Castellani,Lausse,Fullmer. True ? or False?

    Mims beat Brennan,Beacham,Hank,Webb,Benton. True ? or False?

    Downes was middleweight champion.He beat Robinson,D Fullmer,Giardello,Pender,McClure ,McAteer .
    True ? or False?
    Moyer was ranked 9 in1961,6 in1962,9 in1968,2 in1969.Longer and higher than any ranking Papp ever achieved.True ? or False?
    Papp was a ranked middle weight for a total of 3 years, 1962 no7,1963 no4,1964 no 4. True ? or False?
    Papp was never ranked higher than number 4 in the Ring Ratings .True ? or False?
    Papp retired in1964 True ? or False?

    He could have fought Giardello in1962 or 1963 when both were ranked .
    Giardello turned pro in1948 and retired in1967.
    Papp turned pro in 1957 and retired in 1964
    So their careers overlapped,and Papp had ample time to fight Giardello had he wished to, and all the other names I mentioned.

    I've answered all your points, now answer mine!
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2019
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  11. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    01 - Mike Gibbons
    02 - Charley Burley
    03 - Holman Williams
    04 - Bert Lytell
    05 - Lloyd Marshall
    06 - Billy Conn
    07 - Georgie Abrahms
    08 - Young Corbett III
    09 - Jack Chase
    10 - Cocoa Kid

    Stuff like Smith holding the Australian version and Kid McCoy making a lightly recognised claim is excluding them by strict criteria. I'd lean to including them otherwise.
     
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  12. mcvey

    mcvey Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Gibbons is an excellent pick HTF did I miss him? Abrams,Cocoa Kid too!
     
  13. Ra's Al-Ghul

    Ra's Al-Ghul The one and only! Full Member

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    Does it mean you have to be worse in your last fight than in your first?

    Did Jones only 2 out of these 6 and won shortly before against an opponent with 18 wins, 0 defeats and 2 draws?

    Was Torres at his best or even at an weight where he fought for a major title?

    Who are Beechman, Beton and Brannon? Some disco thugs?

    I think Pender did, not Downes. He lost two times as oftem (with one lucky/ questionable win) against him true or false?

    False, Papp was number 1 contender not only by the NBA, was Moyer ever listed that high?

    He defeated his successors Jones and Müller twice, so Giardello was at that time probably not good enough to compete with him.
    Pender was also mostly champion at their simultaneaous careers.

    Mazzinghi was it maybe because Light-Middleweight was invented to the professionals in 1966. This was his natural division.

    Which greater achievements than Papp accomplished Jean-Claude Boutier, Robert Villman, Martin Murray, Jack Chase, Jeff Smith, Aaron Wade or Leo Houck?
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2019
  14. Jel

    Jel Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Deary me. ‘Disco thug’ George Benton (not ‘Beton’, by the way)? If you’ve never heard of him, I guess you can’t be expected to understand the nuances of why the fighters in your last paragraph are considered by reasonable fans to have better resumes than Papp as a professional. @mcvey couldn’t have laid it out more clearly for you, but somehow it doesn’t compute. Ignorance is not a virtue, you know, and if you really do like boxing (you do, right? Just checking) you should be thanking @mcvey for schooling you on this - and many other subjects. A little humility goes a long way, my friend...
     
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  15. Jel

    Jel Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Some great suggestions so far in this thread - I’m learning about some fighters I knew nothing about. Will try and compile a full list of these and repost them. Looks like we’ll end up with a top 50! Would be interested to see if we can distill it down into a relative consensus to form a top 10.
     
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