Top 10 since 1990

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by WHU, May 30, 2008.


  1. mgal7414

    mgal7414 Member Full Member

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    Think that Kostya, Lennox, Pernell and Calzaghe all in there.

    Cotto definitely out. Chavez out (best years in the late 80s). Toney probably out too. But to each, their own.
     
  2. WHU

    WHU Member Full Member

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    Can i ask what you think is special about Lewis' skillset, from what i have seen of him he is highly intelligent with a good skillset, i think Cotto has a much wider variety of techniques, i concede Lewis should take Cottos place on my list though
     
  3. WHU

    WHU Member Full Member

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    I think Chavezs' defining performance was in 1990 the fight against Taylor, and as for Whitaker i think his best performance was his rematch with Ramirez, however i would accpet any argument that it was the JCC or Nelson fight if my memory is correct JCC was in 93 and Nelson in 1990
     
  4. Thread Stealer

    Thread Stealer Loyal Member Full Member

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    I think there's also the weight class thing to take into account. Heavyweights, IMO, are for the most part just less complete and skilled overall than welterweights.

    Lennox Lewis did have a very good skillset. He had an excellent jab which he either used with power to bust up his opponents, or as a pawing jab. It set up his murderous right hand. Lewis also had a very good right uppercut, which he used with excellent results against fighters like Evander Holyfield (rematch), Tommy Morrison, Mike Tyson, Justin Fortune, Frank Bruno, and Michael Grant. His left hook doesn't get much mention, but it was the punch that turned everything around against Frank Bruno.

    His defense wasn't the most technically sound. He often kept his left low and it's not like he had the best head movement. I think with Lewis, it was like a case of "the best defense is a good offense". Lewis's chin gets bashed a lot due to the losses to Oliver McCall and Hasim Rahman. I personally say it was alright. When you take into account all the numerous guys he faced that were either big, or at least good, punchers, and realize he only was dropped twice, his defense must be very good.

    I also thought Lewis had an underrated body attack. He didn't use it that much, he usually didn't need to, but it could be pretty effective. Holyfield was never more hurt in the 24 rounds with Lewis as he was in round 5 of the first fight. The punch that did the most damage was a left hook downstairs.
     
  5. TommyV

    TommyV Loyal Member banned

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    Lewis
    Toney
    Sweet Pea
    JCC
    Barrera
    Morales
    Money May
    ODLH
    B-Hop
    RJJ

    Haven't considered it much and I know I've left out the likes of Ricardo Lopez and Evander Holyfield who deserve mentions. Not in order either.
     
  6. WHU

    WHU Member Full Member

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    Jun 18, 2006
     
  7. joekirkbycobra

    joekirkbycobra King Of The Ring Full Member

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    weres pbf , sweet pea n sugar shane
     
  8. TFFP

    TFFP Guest

    - Defence is part of a skillset, Lewis edges him in all areas here. Guard is tighter, better footwork to get out of range, and upper body movement is subtle and goes unnoticed. You don't see Lewis getting tagged half as much, which pretty much stands to reason considering the few times he really got hit with a power punch he got KO'd

    - Jab. Cotto has developed a very good jab, much improved and underrated. Lewis has an ATG jab, he won fights with that alone. Cotto's is not at that level, he just uses it to setup stronger areas of his offence such as body attacks

    - Variety of work. Of course they are completely different styles so it is tricky to compare, but Lewis had the ability to fight forward or backwards. He could apply pressure, as he did when he blasted Golota out. He can also counterpunch. Can Cotto? Cotto is more effective than Lewis applying pressure, but Lewis can also do this when he wants to, whereas Cotto's counterpunching and standup boxing isn't even in the same ballpark

    Lewis excels him in most physical areas as well. They are both pretty quick, but Lewis is faster p4p I reckon. Lewis has one punch power, Cotto doesn't. Lewis was the master of going 12 and managing his stamina (at his peak anyway) whilst Cotto has some trouble
     
  9. KO Boxing

    KO Boxing Boxing Addict Full Member

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    He was old, out of shape, and CLEARLY not as hit best. It's hard to judge him based on this fight.

    Although I do agree that Lennox didn't have the best defence technically. Just sayin'.
     
  10. WHU

    WHU Member Full Member

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    Jun 18, 2006
    Ye i agree he was out of shape, i find it hard to pick a fight for which to judge him on
     
  11. WHU

    WHU Member Full Member

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    PBF was on the list first name i think and i said i would have Sweat Pea on my 80s list as i think his best performance was his rematch with Ramirez in 89 but i can see the arguments for him to be included based on his performance against Azumah Nelson in 90 and Chavez in 93.For me Mosley doesn't make the top 10, Cotto shouldnt either even though i had him on my original list.
     
  12. Thread Stealer

    Thread Stealer Loyal Member Full Member

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    Mercer hit him with more frequency than any other fighter.
     
  13. WHU

    WHU Member Full Member

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    Which fights are you basing this tight guard on because against both Bruno and Klitschko he was tagged consistently. I really find it hard to understand this statement. And i think Cottos defence is improving ie the Mosley fight.

    Yes Lewis had a great jab and i would say it is better than Cotto,yes his jab is underrated. The reason i think that it is underrated is that Lewis had a long reach and it is easier to see the way in which he is using it whereas Cotto wil use the jab to set up attacks or move his opponent where he wants him;Cottos jab will develop further though.

    Cotto has a much wider variety in terms of different guards different attacks angles, he can box and swarm the only thing i see Lewis do better than Cotto in this respect is boc on the back foot, however it is too early to say Cotto cant box on the back foot.Much like it is too early for me to put him in the top 10 since 1990.

    Physically Lewis is the superior athelete and mentally i would give the edge to Lewis as he had an exceptional boxing brain Cottos appears to be good but it is too early to tell how good.

    I feel it is extremely difficult to compare the skillsets due to the weight classes but i really find it hard to agree with anyone who thinks in terms of skill Cotto is inferior to Lewis,however i may agree if you said in relative terms Lewis had the superios skillset but quanitfying skillsets in relative terms is of course impossible
     
  14. Asterion

    Asterion Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    1. Pernell Whitaker
    2. Julio Cesar Chavez
    3. Roy Jones
    4. Floyd Mayweather
    5. Bernard Hopkins
    6. Lennox Lewis
    7. Oscar De la Hoya
    8. Manny Pacquiao
    9. Marco Antonio Barrera
    10. Erik Morales

    Others:

    Lopez
    Mosley
    Calzaghe
    Toney
    Tszyu


    *I am counting Whitaker and Chavez' whole careers.
     
  15. TFFP

    TFFP Guest

    Klitschko fight should be void from discussion in skillset terms, because it had been eroded so much. It would be the equivelent of taking Cotto at 10-0 as a base for comparison

    I don't remember the Bruno fight specifically, I havn't seen it in a long time, but over the course of his prime I don't remember Lennox being tagged with much. Even if they landed they were often partial blows. He used the jab to control the distance so well, and clinched a lot in close, it was all part of the defence mechanism making him difficult to tag. That probably should have been my initial point, because his guard isn't technically great, you are quite right.

    I don't know what you were watching in the Mosley fight, I downloaded that today by coincidence, he got tagged with some heavy ass shots early on. The only positive I'd take from that would be his chin is looking more and more solid at the weight, defensively it certainly wasn't comparable with a prime Lewis. Whether its improved or not I'll take your word, I'd have to compare back to some older fights

    The rest I agree with