For the first time I made the Top list. Best flyweight's (1950-1990) A major criterion for me has always been and will be the fighter's opposition. WHO, WHEN and HOW convicingly he defeated. Number of championship reigns and defenses is the second ัriteria. I almost don't consider H2H abilities. Raise the question, "why are Kingpetch and Chitalada too low?". Their victories (especially in second fights vs Harada/Ebihara, Yong Kang Kim/Chang) were VERY disputable or unfair. So: 1) Miguel Canto 2) Chartchai Chionoi 3) Betulio Gonzalez 4) Hiroyuki Ebihara 5) Masao Ohba 6) Pascual Perez 7) Horacio Accavallo 8) Santos Laciar 9) Erbito Salavarria 10) Susumu Hanagata 11) Pone Kingpetch 12) Efren Torres 13) Shoji Oguma 14) Chan Hee Park 15) Venice Borkhorsor 16) Yoshio Shirai 17) Luis Ibarra 18) Yong Kang Kim 19) Sot Chitalada 20) Masahiko Harada Honorable mention: Burruni, Magri, Mcgowan, Dado Marino
I'm afraid I've never even heard of a few of these guys, so my list may look a bit lacking. But I think these are clearly the best of them, and aside from having Canto first (which should be a staple), you could probably have it in any order. #1. Miguel Canto #2. Masoa Oba #3. Pascual Perez #4. Betulio Gonzalez #5. Hiroyuki Ebihara #6. Pone Kingpetch #7. Horacio Accavallo #8. Chartchai Chionoi
Amos, great list, one which you apparently spent some time culling. I've always been a H2H kind of guy when making lists, but using your criteria I would only question a couple of placements. So out of curiosity, why was Venice Borkorsor so low when he beat Erbito Salavarria and Betulio Gonzalez - both in their relative prime - who are both rated above him? Also, the same question for Horacio Accavallo, who beat Hiroyuki Ebihara twice, and is rated below him?
Thank you for opinion. Ebihara has better opposition than Accavallo (Aoki nearly at prime, young Chionoi, prime Kingpetch and Efren. All of them he beat convicingly. Three of them by TKO/KO). And Ebihara didn't lose at his prime unlike Accavallo (TKO Tanabe). As for Venice... Yeah, I thought that he could have been higher. But there are other guys with very strong resume... Borkhorsor beat three great names (Cabanela, Salavarria and Betulio) but maybe he lacked "longevity" (as Harada). But yeah, I can see him higher than Chan Hee Park and Oguma
Out of curiosity, do you know of any reports on the Borkorsor v Cabanela fight? I've been trying to find something on that one for years.
Unfortunately I didn't, as about other Cabanela fights. I know that he has good opposition and was tall for this weight. I heard that Borkhorsor's fights with Betulio and Salavarria were recorded on video, but I've never seen it. Not sure about Cabanela fight, though
Pity, I saw his fight that garnered him his title shot against Ohba. It was against Halimi Gutierrez and I recall it being a terrific fight. It was very close but it was Cabanela's ranginess that won it for him. I was always interested in his fight with Borkorsor, though.
The guy whose placement feels strangest to me is Oguma. Hanagata above Oguma? Oguma ten spots below Gonzalez? Oguma's and Canto's 45 rounds together didn't do much to determine who was the better fighter. The first fight appears to have been very close, the second fight is generally regarded as a robbery, and the third fight (which is available in full) was a clear and deserved win for Canto, in my opinion. Even though Canto went 3-0 (compared to 2-1 vs. Gonzalez), I think Oguma gave him the tougher fights. Oguma fought Gonzalez four times, twice when Oguma was barely world-level (this is being generous on my part; Oguma hadn't fought anything like a world class opponent before his ten-rounder with Gonzalez, and he actually got a dubious top-ten ranking by virtue of losing that fight), and twice when Gonzalez was a bit past his prime but still a defending champion. Again, it's hard to say who the better fighter was in that series, especially given that Oguma deserved to win the third fight. Gonzalez got the rivalry's only knockout, but Oguma should have won two of the three fifteen-rounders. These are #1 and #3 on the list, and Oguma was right at their level when they went head to head. After that he added three wins against the man who'd beaten Canto (we know the story on the second fight, but Oguma still cleanly won two of those). The only person to ever beat him easily when he was at or near his prime was Alfonso Lopez. Oguma does have a bad loss to Kimio Furesawa in there. Still, instinctively I feel like he should be closer to Gonzalez than to someone like Luis Ibarra.
Concerning Oguma vs Canto 2 "Robbery" fight, I haven't seen that fight and can't judge. Well, If it's the true, Oguma would be higher. Betulio - Oguma (2-2), but Gonzalez scored KO victory. Yes, Hanagata for me above (1-1 vs Chionoi, Torres and Ohba, disputed fights vs Salavarria and wins against Cabanela, Mojica, Hayase). And no disrespect for Shoji, I like his style. Really uncomfortable match for anyone.
I haven't seen the fight either, but Japanese accounts usually describe it that way. It could easily be a myth, so you're probably right to rank only on what you know for sure. Hanagata has some nice names on his list, but a lot of them are in ten-rounders rather than championship length, and Ohba was only 18 for that fight. I'll admit to being much more familiar with Oguma's fights than with Hanagata's; I'll try to watch some Hanagata in the near future. Canto is one of my favorites, and I have a lot of respect for the challenges Oguma posed to him. Definitely an interesting list, though. I could never put something like that together.
Hello Now the second Betulio - Oguma fight is on youtube and this is bad bull****... Gonzalez clearly won this fight
