Top 200 All Time List, Impossible Task ?

Now now DINAMITA you know the 'classic' forum is no place for slagging off, that kind of thing only goes on in the general 'boxing forum'

I compiled this list a while ago with the hope that the experts on this forum would tweak it/perform major surgery on it, so we would end up with a reasonable atg top 200, i would particularly welcome some of the more respected posters on here to come out with their own atg top 200 {lets face it i have done most of the ground work and regardless of how poor some people may think my list is if they produced their own list, i am sure as many as 150 boxers off my list would be on their list, it is a starting point at least}

When i say respected posters i dont mean you DINAMITA, to coin a phrase used by yourself :-
I CANT TAKE ANYONE SERIOUSLY THAT HAS:
no George Dixon or James J Jeffries in their top 100.

No only kidding DINAMITA you are welcome to creating an atg 200 as i am sure you would make a good one as you are learning and gaining knowledge all the time, you do make some good points about the list ?

When you mentioned Donald Curry i thought i definately left him out in error as i remember him being regarded as one of the best p4p boxers in his day {he even beat Wales Colin Jones:crying} then i checked his record only to see he lost against Honeyghan {182 on list} Nunn {193} Norris{151} and McCallum {79} so perhaps he was 'hyped up' like Pavlik ?

I will update/amend the list shortly :happy

 

1] Sugar Ray Robinson
2] Armstrong
3] Langford
4] Greb
5] Pep
6] Duran
7] Wilde
8] Fitzsimmons
9] Tunney
10] Jack Johnson
11] Charles
12] B.Leonard
13] R.Leonard
14] Louis
15] Ali
16] Gans
17] Jofre
18] Walker
19] Moore
20] Burley
21] Ketchel
22] Marciano
23] Saddler
24] B.Ross
25] Whitaker
26] Monzon
27] Salvador Sanchez
28] Roy Jones Jnr
29] Canzoneri
30] I.Williams
31] Jack Dempsey
32] Hagler
33] Babadoes Joe Walcott
34] Holmes
35] Dixon
36] Cesar Charvez
37] E.Griffith
38] Arguello
39] Holyfield
40] Kid Gavilan
41] Hearns
42] Napoles
43] M.Ortiz
44] L.Lewis
45] Mayweather Jnr
46] Calzaghe
47] Britton
48] Olivares
49] M.Spinks
50] Pacquiao
51] Hopkins
52] Wills
53] Harada
54] W.Gomez
55] foster
56] Villa
57] Loughran
58] R.Lopez
59] Attell
60] Al Brown
61] C.Ortiz
62] Dick Tiger
63] Conn
64] Perez
65] Canto
66] McGovern
67] Trinidad
68] Ted Kid Lewis
69] Kid Chocolate
70] Joe Brown
71] Tiger Flower
72] Cerdan
73] Jeffries
74] Pryer
75] Basilio
76] Dundee
77] McLarnin
78] T.Ryan
79] McCallum
80] Montgomery
81] Beau Jack
82] Freddie Welsh
83] W.Benitez
84] De La Hoya
85] Barrera
86] Gibbons
87] Kilbane
88] Blackburn
89] Ambers
90] Tyson
91] H.Williams
92] Liston
93] Herman
94] Philly Jack O'Brien
95] LM Rodriquez
96] Cervantes
97] Zarate
98] Driscoll
99] Toney
100]Galaxy
101]Hatton
102]Tszyu
103]Rosenbloom
104]Zale
105]Vicente Salvador
106]LaBarba
107]Kid Williams
108]Genero
109]Nonpareil Jack Dempsey
110]Battling Nelson
111]B.Lynch
112]La Motta
113]Foreman
114]Frazier
115]Wolgast
116]Loi
117]Carpentier
118]Locche
119]Gushiken
120]Kane
121]Jersey Joe Walcott
122]Dillon
123]Marshall
124]Graziano
125]Delaney
126]Camacho
127]Sharkey
128]J.Lynch
129]Kingpetch
130]Barry
131]Buchanan
132]Benvenuti
133]Baer
134]Jeanette
135]Kessler
136]Buff
137]Coulon
138]Chandler
139]Dawson
140]Wladimir Klitscko
141]P.Jackson
142]Morales
143]Winky Wright
144]Mosley
145]Blackburn
146]Griffo
147]Kid Berg
148]H.Johnson
149]Elorde
150]Norris
151]Escobar
152]Freddie Steele
153]Azumah Nelson
154]Bud Taylor
155]Accavallo
156]James J Corbett
157]Bivins
158]McFarland
159]Moran
160]Ohba
161]H.Gonzalez
162]JM Marquez
163]Hamed
164]Patterson
165]Kid McCoy
166]McGuigan
167]Freddie Miller
168]Carbajal
169]F.Burns
170]Winstone
171]Levinsky
172]Fullmer
173]McAuliffe
174]E.Pedroza
175]Pintor
176]Coulon
177]Pal Moore
178]Becerra
179]Jung Koo Chang
180]Fenech
181]Honeyghan
182]Collins
183]Qawi
184]John Henry Lewis
185]Eubank
186]Benn
187]Saad Muhammed
188]Bowe
189]Schmeling
190]Turpin
191]Michalczewski
192]Nunn
193]Virgil Hill
194]John L Sullivan
195]Ritchie
196]Barkley
197]Lew Jenkins
198]Chris John
199]Ottke
200]Bute

Seen lots of All Time Great top 100's on the net, but never a top 200 ?

Update:- Joppy and Pavlik given the boot, replaced by Winky Wright and Bute, could have played safe and picked somebody like Ken Norton instead of Bute ?,Bute last 4 wins over Bika,Berrio,Joppy and Andrade {last 3 for a World title} combined with his career 0 swung it for me. Winky record is much better than i realised so he goes in at 143. Two major movers Lou Ambers whos record is better than i first thought moves up into the top 100 and Sugar Shane Mosley whos record is worse than i thought moves out of the top 100 conviently 1 place behind Winky who to my surprise has beaten Sugar Shane twice.
B.Ross moves above Canzoneri as had been pointed out to me, Ross has a 2-0 head to head, although it seems both results were paper thin decisions.
The other movements are small to accommodate recent results, Bhops and Manny winning and De La Hoya losing, i did not think JC win over RJJ or Hattons recent win warrented any movement.

 

This list is not a P4P list, it is a ''IM A BETTER BOXER AT MY WEIGHT THAN YOU ARE AT YOUR WEIGHT'' list, for example Sugar Ray Robinson was a better Welterweight than Marciano was a Heavyweight, so he gets ranked above him, Jimmy Wilde was a better Flyweight boxer than Ricardo Lopez was a Straweight boxer so he gets ranked above him.

Observations about lists -
P4P is crap ?, boxers that spend most of their career at one weight tend to be penalised also it puts Heavyweights at a disadvantage as a fully blown Heavyweight can only operate at that weight.
In P4P lists not only do smaller boxers do well, but defeats dont matter, a well known poster on here told me that Pacman could lose to De La Hoya and it would not effect his position in p4p lists unfortunately he is correct, a ranking system that allows boxers to lose and not be downgraded is pathetic, just because that boxer lost to a bigger man.
As far as i am concerned if a boxer gets into a ring with another boxer and loses, 9 times out of 10 i would perceive the winner as the better boxer, i cant have he moved up 2 weight divisions and although he lost he should be ranked higher bull****.
Sport is about winning, as good as Pacman is he has been beaten 3 times and drawn twice. i bet he will end up with a couple more defeats at the end of his career {like most boxers do} some people are saying he could be a top 20 atg, oh yes a modern boxer who only fights two or three times a year with 5 defeats and 2 draws a top 20 atg ?
Thats why i cant have Pacman above Mayweather or Calzaghe.

In my mind winning and losing in the ring counts for something.
Qawi leads Saad Muhammed 2-0, so i rank Qawi higher
Collins leads Eubank 2-0
Collins leads Benn 2-0
Eubank leads Benn 1-0 {and a draw} so i rank Collins,Eubank,Benn
McGuigan leads Pedroza 1-0 so i rank McGuigan higher
Hatton leads Tszyu 1-0 so i rank Hatton higher {i dont think Tszyu was shot although he retired after the fight}
Foreman leads Frazier 2-0 so i rank Foreman higher
i use the above examples because a lot of people would rank those boxers the other way
i was advised that Ross holds a 2-0 over Canzoneri, so i changed their rankings,
once i realised Winky Wright had a 2-0 over Mosley the list was changed.

There are lots of examples of boxers having a winning record and still been placed behind
the boxer they beat on the list.
Terry Norris is still ranked behind Sugar Ray Leonard and
Joe Calzaghe is still ranked behind Roy Jones Jnr {although the only reason Calzaghe is listed above Hopkins is due to his win over the executioner,Hopkins is still 80% to 90% prime the same as Calzaghe, i see Calzaghe beating Hopkins at most stages of their careers}.
As you can see head to head is not the be all and end all, but i do favour wins in the ring.

If anybody knows of boxers on the list who have a winning record over other boxers on the list and are ranked below them let me know !
{as long as it is not Norris/Leonard scenario}

Do you notice i like boxers with 0's Marciano,Mayweather,Calzaghe even Dawson,Ottke and Bute { the last 2 are #199 and #200}
I just dont like losers, once Dawson and Bute lose i can see them been booted off the list just like Pavlik was, unless Dawson loses to Calzaghe and takes him to the wire he might just stay inside the top 200 {but be demoted}. :thumbsup

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Come on sweet_scientist lets see your top 200 as i am sure you would be able to make a very reasonable list.