Top 25 all time greatest heavyweights

Stop it. It's the worst using of double standards I've EVER read on this forum. If you are criticizing Holmes for "openly ducking" Page and Thomas, why the hell aren't you criticizing Lewis for ducking Byrd and Ruiz? And if you are bringing a win over shot to sh1t Mike Tyson in Lewis resume, why aren't you bringing Ali in the Holmes resume? Tyson win was absolutely irrelevant for Lewis, it was just a name, even Steward called him a corpse in the break between the middle rounds. Danny Williams knocked out te same version of Tyson but did it 2 times quicker then Lewis and, unlike Lewis, he didn't hold him in 80+ clinches during the fight.

 

Wlad is top 10 , Tyson is not.

 

Fury is the most overrated HW ever absolute bum

 

Impressive breakdown sir even if I don’t fully agree with the listing. Good read

 

I really appreciate it. And no, I did not even read that Celestial guy's reply. I am not even sure he is a boxing fan per se, but seems like an internet oddball.

That's the worst use of hyperbole I have EVER read on this forum.

No scare quotes needed--he OPENLY ducked them. Bragged about it. Said things like "If they want me back, they've got to give me someone I can beat," and "I like fighting little guys for big money." He was proud of the fact that he leveraged the title for soft fights.

You know if your big Ukranian heart that Lewis world have murdered Byrd and Ruiz on the same night, and I am saying that as huge Byrd fan, and a guy who respected Ruiz.

A) He got the version on Tyson he could get.
B) That is all hindsight. A lot of the fans were picking Tyson to win at the time.

 

1. Saying Lewis would have murdered Byrd and Ruiz in the same night is actually the worst use of hyperbole here.

2. Holmes relinquished his WBC title not to face Page. Lewis relinquished his WBA and IBF titles not to face Ruiz and Byrd. That's are facts, other thing are just speculations.

3. Ruiz would be definitely harder opponent than Grant, and Byrd would be MUCH harder opponent for Lewis than corpse of Tyson (Lewis relinquished IBF title because he hoped to face a corpse of Tyson in the absolutely pointless rematch).

4. A lot of boxing fans were picking Gatti to beat Floyd. The opinion of casuals is completely irrelevant. I believe that out of 24 boxing experts only 2 picked Tyson to beat Lewis. 22 picked Lewis to beat him. Michael Katz picked Lewis to demolish corpse of Tyson in 90 seconds.

 

The obvious difference is that Lewis unified belts and Holmes did not. Lewis, getting on and having nothing left to prove, could let go of a couple of belts, because he had legitimately earned all of them.

Holmes never unified anything, and abjectly surrendered the only belt he had, accepting another form the gutter, giving an upstart organization instant credibility.

Disgusting.

 

Alrighty, now, my list is simply who would win in a fight in their primes, my P4P list is the only one where I rank greatness. That being said, looking for some constructive criticism with placings (and please don't mention size unless it's literally Tommy Burns against Anthony Joshua):

25. Cleveland Williams

24. Ingemar Johansson

23. Bob Fitzsimmons

22. David Tua

21. Vitali Klitschko

20. Tommy Morrison

19. Harry Wills

18. Max Baer

17. Floyd Patterson

16. Jack Johnson

15. Gene Tunney

14. Ezzard Charles

13. Wladimir Klitschko

12. Joe Walcott

11. Joe Frazier


10. Mike Tyson


9. Lennox Lewis


8. Evander Holyfield


7. Sonny Liston


6. Jack Dempsey


5. Larry Holmes


4. George Foreman



1c. Rocky Marciano


1b. Joe Louis


1a. Muhammad Ali


I really think Riddick Bowe and James Jeffries needs to be on this list but I can't figure where

 

Hang on lazy arse, ask the question with a contribution from yourself too; As in..'mine is blah blah etc'...It's like 'discuss?'...questions; you do jack **** apart from the question, but expect others to do the work and carry the thread. Pet hate.

 

H2H big bro Klit>All

 

he'd agreed with the wba to fight ruiz after grant.], this is fact. He was stripped because King during the run up to the Grant fight, took him to court for not immediately facing him.

I am not sure what your facts are, but lewis wasnt interested in byrd at the end of his career, correct, he instead destroyed the guy who got destroyed by byrd and then retired at 38. You cant fight someone when retired, but perhaps you think you can.

 

Ali, Joe Luis, Foreman, Larry, Marciano, Lennox, Holyfield, Tyson, Frazier, Dempsey, Vitali, Wlad,Liston ,Bowe, Norton, Walcott, Spinks, Tunney, Baer, Ike, Shavers, Walcott, Byrd, Wilder, AJ (last two aren’t done and def have a chance to move up but couldn’t leave them off). Not so sure putting Tunney on was the right call but his record skewed me to. Everyone else is placed where I think if they all fought each other their record best to worst. AJ and Wilder prob better then their placement but they’re early in there careers yet

 

Roughly my thoughts go something like this...

#1 and #2: Ali, Louis

Certain top 10 guys: Johnson, Marciano, Foreman, Lennox, Holmes, Jeffries

Next tier up: Frazier, Holyfield, Wladimir, Dempsey, Ezzard

Next tier: Tyson, Langford, Wills, Schmeling, Liston, Patterson

And yet the next tier: Vitali, Walcott, Burns, Bowe, McVea, Jeannette

And then yet another tier: Baer, Sharkey, Willard, Carnera, Ingemar, Povetkin, Joshua, Norton, Shavers, etc.

...there is also Tunney and Spinks, hard to place them exactly. Same with Sullivan and Corbett. I guess if push comes to shove they have to crack it. I'm sure there are a couple names I've messed up or implications I've made with the "tiers" I don't fully mean but otherwise this about sums it up.

 

Good stuff...

One thing I'll say about my opinion: James J. Jeffries is a beast. Read about him. I disagree with anyone who puts Jack Johnson outside the top 10. Both of those guys are much better than Dempsey by any measure. Also, look into Ezzard Charles. Just because he is one of the greatest Light Heavies of all time didn't mean he didn't have a surprising lot of highly relevant fights at Heavy too. He is similar to Tunney in that regard, whom you rank very highly, but had even more fights at HW in my memory serves.

 

Problem I personally always have with including those real early guys was style. Not that they weren’t athletic enough to modernize their style but the styles were so far off I don’t see them competing. I had Tunney and Dempsey on my list they were slightly more modern but even then I have my doubts. Jack v Dempsey would have been interesting.