Top 50 all time head to head under 200lb

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by SuzieQ49, Jun 29, 2015.


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  1. SuzieQ49

    SuzieQ49 The Manager Full Member

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    Based strictly on Head to Head Ability

    Strictly Head to Head

    1. Joe Louis
    2. Rocky Marciano
    3. Jack Johnson
    4. Jack Dempsey
    5. Evander Holyfield
    6. Max Schmeling
    7. Ezzard Charles
    8. Gene Tunney
    9. Jersey Joe Walcott
    10. Sam Langford
    11. Floyd Patterson
    12 Billy Conn
    13. Archie Moore
    14. Michael Spinks
    15 Roy Jones Jr.
    16. Jack Sharkey
    17. Harold Johnson
    18. Peter Jackson
    19 James J Corbett
    20. Ingemar Johansson
    21. Bob Fitzimmons
    22. Harry Greb
    23. Jimmy Bivins
    24. James Toney
    25. David Haye
    26. Dwight Muhammad Qawi
    27. Elmer Ray
    28. Tommy Loughran
    29. Jimmy Ellis
    30. Zora Folley
    30. Eddie Machen
    31. Jerry Quarry
    32 Tom Sharkey
    33. Joe Jeanette
    34 Clarence henry
    35 Steve Hamas
    36 Bob Foster
    37 Bob Pastor
    38 Rex Layne
    39 Sugar Ray Robinson
    40. Bernard Hopkins
    41 Andre Ward
    42 Joey Maxim
    43 Bob Satterfield
    44 Willie Pastrano
    45 Doug Jones
    46 Kid Norfolk
    47 James J Braddock
    48 Billy Miske
    49 Mickey Walker
    50 Leotis Martin

    Hm : Tommy Burns Roland Lastarza
     
    SuzieQ49, Jun 29, 2015
    SuzieQ49, Jun 29, 2015
    #1
  2. Bummy Davis

    Bummy Davis Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Marciano finds a way to win, not sure how many Joe Louis fights were under 200 but he is # 1 in many area's and IMO over 250lbs JL is still # 1 ALL AROUND....Walcott is the spoiler and Gene Tunney proved to be a tough boxer. Sam Langford always dangerous but at 5'7 pushing it in reality....Ezz was in tough and always did well. Archie beat all sizes and Conn was a rugged boxer....Dempsey was the man of steel and hands of stone wrapped up into one....tough and hard, all of these
     
    Bummy Davis, Jun 29, 2015
    Bummy Davis, Jun 29, 2015
    #2
  3. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    1Johnson
    2Dempsey
    3.Holyfield
    4.Marciano
    5.Fitzsimmons
    6.Langford
    7.Tunney
    8.Walcott
    9.Charles
    10.Schmeling.
    I don't think Louis qualifies.
     
    mcvey, Jun 29, 2015
    mcvey, Jun 29, 2015
    #3
  4. he grant

    he grant Historian/Film Maker

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    I like Johnson as top .. Louis and or Dempsey next .. Langfor loses to some of the boxers but to me takes any of the sluggers ..
     
    he grant, Jun 29, 2015
    he grant, Jun 29, 2015
    #4
  5. SuzieQ49

    SuzieQ49 The Manager Full Member

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    Can't see Langford outslugging Marciano or Louis. Archie Moore said he can't see any man slugging it out with Marciano and coming out alive. I agree if the man is under 200b

    Louis would have torn Langford head off

    I like Louis as a strong favorite over Dempsey

    Marciano a slight favorite over Dempsey
     
    SuzieQ49, Jun 29, 2015
    SuzieQ49, Jun 29, 2015
    #5
  6. SuzieQ49

    SuzieQ49 The Manager Full Member

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    Louis beat Braddock Max Baer and max schmeling at 198lb

    He qualifies
     
    SuzieQ49, Jun 29, 2015
    SuzieQ49, Jun 29, 2015
    #6
  7. edward morbius

    edward morbius Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I think a very good list.

    The one issue for me would be Corbett rating over Fitzsimmons as Fitz beat him and also went 15 years w/o losing to a sub-200 pounder except by DQ.

    **I would also have a question about Robinson making this list as he didn't do much above middle. I think folks credit him a bit too much for the Maxim fight which he ended up losing.
     
    edward morbius, Jun 29, 2015
    edward morbius, Jun 29, 2015
    #7
  8. he grant

    he grant Historian/Film Maker

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    I don't view Louis as a slugger but a boxer puncher.
     
    he grant, Jun 29, 2015
    he grant, Jun 29, 2015
    #8
  9. Entaowed

    Entaowed Boxing Addict banned Full Member

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    I agree with your conclusions about match ups amongst the absolute eliits SQ/

    But what about other HWs who were still very good when coming up & young, though pre-prime, before they reached their full size. Surely (If I may call you Shirley...) Ali could easily crack the top 50 ibefore he hit 200.

    What about Frazier? At his peak he was a good 205. He must have had some very good fights on the other side of 200, right?

    How about other HW contenders in The GOlden age, before they got bigger/hit a critical mass in the 80's? Quarry?

    I understand this considers PEAK efficacy, not total accomplishments or record even at this catch weight.
     
    Entaowed, Jun 29, 2015
    Entaowed, Jun 29, 2015
    #9
  10. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    I'll put him in if you like Suze, number three, move everyone else down and Schmeling exits.
     
    mcvey, Jun 30, 2015
    mcvey, Jun 30, 2015
    #10
  11. SuzieQ49

    SuzieQ49 The Manager Full Member

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    What's your reasoning for Johnson and Dempsey over him?
     
    SuzieQ49, Jun 30, 2015
    SuzieQ49, Jun 30, 2015
    #11
  12. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Good stab. My one big objection is to Langford at #10. I'd pick him to beat everyone up to and including Dempsey. I admit Dempsey is close to 50.50 but I suspect that he is close to 50.50 with Louis and Rocky too. I might even pick him against Rocky, though lord knows no money would go down.

    What's the thinking on Jackson and Corbett? I reckon they either need to be a good dunt higher or a good dunt lower.

    But this is a good list.
     
    McGrain, Jun 30, 2015
    McGrain, Jun 30, 2015
    #12
  13. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    H2H Johnson beats him by dec, Dempsey k'os him inside 2 rds.
     
    mcvey, Jun 30, 2015
    mcvey, Jun 30, 2015
    #13
  14. dinovelvet

    dinovelvet Antifanboi Full Member

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    David Haye?? No , just NO!

    I know you pretend he's a world beater cos he's one of Wlads best wins but he isn't.

    Take a look. His career his littered with woeful opponents like this guy.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C8qs456KBwQ
    He never beat anybody and retired early as he knew he could no longer cut it.

    Michael Moorer would paste Haye and he didn't even make your list.
     
    dinovelvet, Jun 30, 2015
    dinovelvet, Jun 30, 2015
    #14
  15. dinovelvet

    dinovelvet Antifanboi Full Member

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    Rocky would lift Langford clean out of his boots. Im not one to argue the merits of size , but when you're as small as Langford was , it matters a lot.

    With Marciano's more refined boxing and brutal uppercut - he blows a hole through Langford.
    I wouldn't have him anywhere near the top 10.
     
    dinovelvet, Jun 30, 2015
    dinovelvet, Jun 30, 2015
    #15
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