Top 50 Middleweight of all Time

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by McGrain, Jul 11, 2015.


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  1. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Agree, agree, I think having had a second look at Soose i'll bump him up to cigar - those guys are getting a second look.
     
    McGrain, Jul 11, 2015
    McGrain, Jul 11, 2015
    #31
  2. dpw417

    dpw417 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    This division is so deep...Ezzard Charles from Tier 8 could could knock off half of Tier 1. Good luck with tis one Mcgrain.
     
    dpw417, Jul 11, 2015
    dpw417, Jul 11, 2015
    #32
  3. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Anything strike you as particularly evil so far?
     
    McGrain, Jul 11, 2015
    McGrain, Jul 11, 2015
    #33
  4. mattdonnellon

    mattdonnellon Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    George Gardner worth a look?
     
    mattdonnellon, Jul 11, 2015
    mattdonnellon, Jul 11, 2015
    #34
  5. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Given the source of the recommendation, I will carry out the look forthwith.
     
    McGrain, Jul 11, 2015
    McGrain, Jul 11, 2015
    #35
  6. lora

    lora Fighting Zapata Full Member

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    Looking at who you have in the bottom three tiers and that list of possible inclusions, Reggie Johnson seems the one who is oddly high to me.

    Of the relatively "modern" post 60s guys that have been brought up he'd be below all but Leonard, Hearns and Golovkin for me.
     
    lora, Jul 12, 2015
    lora, Jul 12, 2015
    #36
  7. Drew101

    Drew101 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Cocoa Kid. CK was great, but the majority of his best work was done at WW.
     
    Drew101, Jul 12, 2015
    Drew101, Jul 12, 2015
    #37
  8. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    I think I agree with Johnson and CK being too high. But CK is 3-0 verus Williams (top 10) and 1-0 with Jack Chase. I'm actually leaning at this time to removing Ezzard Charles, but CK is kind of a steroids version of Charles in terms of resume. This may be balanced by a good dunt of losses though.
     
    McGrain, Jul 12, 2015
    McGrain, Jul 12, 2015
    #38
  9. Foxy 01

    Foxy 01 Boxing Junkie banned

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    SRR 1 - 25, and the rest don't really matter.
     
    Foxy 01, Jul 12, 2015
    Foxy 01, Jul 12, 2015
    #39
  10. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    What film if any did you see on Holman Williams? You just don't see him as a top ten great at middle?

    Roy jones seems too low. He easily defeated Hopinks and Toney.
     
    Mendoza, Jul 12, 2015
    Mendoza, Jul 12, 2015
    #40
  11. Drew101

    Drew101 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Yeah, but Cocoa Kid's best results against Holman occurred when Hardwick was either a WW (or barely over the limit). He has draws against Burley and Williams at MW; but on the whole I'd still say the majority of his best work was done at 147.

    Don't get me wrong...he rates really highly at WW- and in general...But I honestly dunno if he did quite enough to go Top 50 in a pretty stupidly stacked MW division.

    At the risk of sounding obtuse, what am I missing?
     
    Drew101, Jul 12, 2015
    Drew101, Jul 12, 2015
    #41
  12. Arminius

    Arminius Member Full Member

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    Arminius, Jul 12, 2015
    Arminius, Jul 12, 2015
    #42
  13. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Nothing - if you don't think 3-0 versus a top 10 lock is worth consideration.
     
    McGrain, Jul 13, 2015
    McGrain, Jul 13, 2015
    #43
  14. klompton2

    klompton2 Boxing Junkie banned Full Member

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    Some of the black fighters of the 40s are being ridiculously overrated here. Chase? Lytell? Marshall is a stretch, he was a good fighter but when he had to make weight he wasnt as good. His best wins occured above 160. Im not saying those guys were bad fighters but MW is a deep deep division.
     
    klompton2, Jul 13, 2015
    klompton2, Jul 13, 2015
    #44
  15. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Marshall's resume is superb:

    Ken Overlin
    Teddy Yarosz
    Charley Burley
    Jake LaMotta
    Holman Williams
    Jack Chase

    Others. Some of these wins are in circumstances, but overall, that's really very good and compares well to the guys in his tier as a raw resume.

    Jack Chase:

    Aaron Wade
    Paul Lewis
    Lloyd Marshall
    Archie Moore

    Again, few fighters have these type of resume. They compare well to those around them in terms of who they beat - it's a question of how far back their losses will drag them.
     
    McGrain, Jul 13, 2015
    McGrain, Jul 13, 2015
    #45
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