Topic of the minute - Ali vs Shavers 15th round.....you score it!!!!

Interesting debate this one is. No one disagrees that Ali handily won the last half minute or so. Also, hardly anyone disagrees with the fact that Shavers was leading after the first 2:30. Despite such near unanimity we have a friendly but strong debate about who won the round. This really shows the complexity and difficulty that can exist in scoring a boxing match.

Personally, I don't believe the round was super close or that Shavers dominated the first 2:30 of the round. I just think Ali did enough at the end of the round to snag the 15th despite being a bit behind.

 

Whelp I guess this explains how Adelaide Byrd managed to give Canelo a lopsided score in the first GGG fight.

 

Popularity bias. Shavers beat him around the ring, landing the harder and cleaner shots. Maybe you watched a different fight

 

We often do not even realize the extent of our OWN bias, fuhgettibout others.
However sometimes what we want to be true is-& sometimes it is unclear or too close to call.
Often we are wrong. Other times we may be what I call "coincidentally right".
We would believe some things REGARDLESS of the nature & quality of the evidence.

Sometimes Ali did not land effectively in fights but due to popularity & last minute rallies got rounds credited undeservedly.
But in this 15th round case he was not "shoeshining" & it was Shavers who sometimes lacked accuracy & effectiveness.
Here is how I see it.

I divide it into 2 main parts.
For the first

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Much closer than I recalled initially. Back and forth for about the first 2 1/2 minutes. Ernie rocked him a few times with those long right hands. Muhammad walked Shavers into a few nice counters and had some decent flurries. Ali had Shavers on wobbly legs in the last 30 seconds. Ali round for me but so close, I would respect the scoring of it for Shavers much more now though than prior to my rewatching. Turning sound off helped.

 

Agree JT. Certainly a warranted and worthwhile thread question/poll. Nice decision to set up a vote and open up discussion on same.

 

Shavers did dominate the first 2 min 30 sec, he clearly out landed Ali and landed heavy blows in that time frame. Ali's punches weren't doing any damage to Shavers. This is pro boxing, not amateur level, you're supposed to hurt your opponent.
Ali only did damage in the last 30 seconds, but that's not enough to sway the round his way.

 

The ones that connected were pretty good compared to Ali's that did no damage whatsoever in those 2 min 30 sec

 

I couldn't disagree more imagine Frazier/Ali, Muhammad/Lopez, Norton/Holmes, not being 15 round fights. If anything it added to the greatness of a fighter being able to pull it out in the last 3 rounds and gave it an extra special feeling. I actually feel like Holyfield/Bowe, Marquez/Pacquiao, Barrera/Morales, would of benefitted being 15 round fights.

As for the topic i scored the fight 8-7 in favour of Ali here's my scorecard.

Muhammad Ali vs Earnie Shavers

1 Ali
2 Shavers
3 Ali
4 Shavers
5 Ali
6 Shavers
7 Shavers
8 Shavers
9 Ali
10 Ali
11 Ali
12 Ali
13 Shavers
14 Shavers
15 Ali

143-142 Ali

As you can see i scored the 15th round in favour of Ali, Shavers was winning the round but Ali stole it clearly for me in the last 30 seconds. This wasn't like Holmes briefly having a good moment in the last 10 seconds of another great 15th round vs Norton, it was a very strong last 30 seconds in which Ali had Shavers out on his feet. I think that's clearly enough indication that Ali deserved to win the round based on that.

PS i accidentally voted for Shavers and can't change my vote, so just take 1 away from Shavers and add it to Ali when tallying up the votes.

 

I am not going to argue with a blind man. I time stamped the entire round and showed many times when Ali rocked Shavers and snapped his head before the end of the round.

 

Please share with me those time stamps.

 

Google eye on the ring. Shavers-Ali. It's a site where boxing fans score fights. If my memory is correct the first ten scorers scored round 15 for Ali as did all the judges

 

WB - the time stamps provided by GCC are back on page 2.