True or false did we miss out on seeing true peak Ali?

Not sure how much more peak we could get than the Williams fight...he was borderline supernatural then.

 

Not really. He'd still have to have served. I'm sure his version of service would have been to fly around and meet troops and do exhibitions for morale building, not running through the jungle, but still. He wouldn't have been fighting pro.

 

We missed out on some beautiful boxing for sure

 

Yeah, that's true, but for how long? He wouldn't have served more than 2 years maximum, and he might have been allowed a couple of defences, we don't know. It wasn't discussed or considered because he wasn't taking that course of action.

I mean, we do know that he chose to risk his career and liberty, lost 3 1/2 years of his career, and in theory at least could have been jailed for 5 years for his choice. So, in fact, he did choose a worse option for his career anyway.

 

My main point being, it doesn't really matter how much "blame" and "responsibility" we put on them for missing out on fighting those prime years.
It's all the same really. Inactivity, years they can't get back. Whether it's laziness and cocaine or WW2 or Vietnam or injury or prison or a Hollywood film career.

 

We will never know....however it is probably a good bet we missed out on the greatest version

3 yrs away from competition is a long time and it does make me wonder if his maturation with peak skills may have seen a better version yet OR was his 2nd career a result of the 3 yrs gone? it seems it was his resurgence in the 70's that defined him as the greatest

 

No. He didn’t go to Vietnam of his own choice. Not quit boxing.

He briefly retired after being banned for three years with no appearent way back, but that's of course not the same thing.

 

True, of course.

He left just after turning 25 and returned a few months before turning 29.

 

Ali didn't choose to have his titles stripped, his passport revoked so he couldn't leave the country, and have his boxing license removed so he couldn't fight.

Throughout history, if you look at all the countries who have produced world champions, how many of those champions had their titles stripped because they wouldn't join their own country's military?

Countries all over the world are fighting in wars all the time. I can't think of any champs who lost their title because they wouldn't join their military back home.

The WBA stripped him within minutes of him refusing military service, and the org was already holding its vacant title tournament fights three months after Ali refused to enter the Army.

They weren't "planning a tournament" three months later, they were holding the first quarterfinal bouts.

It was definitely out of the ordinary. Wouldn't it be easier to defend a title if you WEREN'T in the military?

If Russia and Ukraine start fighting, is Usyk going to be stripped of his titles if he doesn't go home and join the military? I don't see it.

 

maybe a better comparison, but not good enough.
tyson had obvious mental problems and a devastating ko defeat not long before his forced break. he had lost his status of invincibility by 1990 and back then many thought he was slipping.

not really.
the majority felt and understood that he was forced to give up his title.

 

Yeah, that was a fair bit of nonsense from Unforgiven.

 

Well you go to jail if you refuse to serve, I guess.
Ali was willing to risk five years in jail.
Having passport taken away is normal if you are facing criminal charges.

The American politicians and governors immediately pressured the boxing state commissions to deny him a licence. The WBA stripped him. Yes it is unprecedented.
Ali's friend and attorney Bob Arum immediately arranged the WBA tournament. Yes that is weird.

 

Which bit was nonsense?

Ali is pretty much ADMIRED by many (myself included) for being prepared to go to prison for his principle. He took a stand. He made his choice. He knew he could lose everything. He didn't try to compromise or negotiate or squeeze a few more fights in while toeing the line. He took his stand with no compromise. It was an act of will, a willful act. That's why people respect him for it.

 

Well, he refused, and he didn't go to jail for five years.

My point is Ali had no reason to believe refusing to enter the military meant he would be stripped of the title or denied a right to defend it. The WBA and the NY State Athletic Commission stripped Ali within minutes of him refusing military service. Minutes.

And, if he'd never been stripped, Ali could've defended the title through all of his appeals up to 1971, when his conviction was overturned.

He didn't serve time without the belt and he wouldn't have if he still had it the whole time. In fact, he'd have had more money to mount a defense if he could actually have defended it.

Stripping a boxer of the titles because he wouldn't sign up for his country's military doesn't happen.

Ali had no reason to believe it was going to happen to him.