Tszyu vs Hurtado

It was a very good fight.

Hurtato was a good fighter and Tzyu is overrated.

 

Hurtado came in the first era of cubans post-revolution, sadly his managment was awful and he considered his freedom his world title.
He was good, with a bad chin but really skilled and it was a really fun fight, but Tszyu broke him.

 

You know nothing if you think Kosta is overrated.

I followed his amateur career and pro career - he was a very special talent.

 

QUOTE="Brixton Bomber, post: 18272750, member: 103201"]You know nothing if you think Kosta is overrated.

I followed his amateur career and pro career - he was a very special talent.[/QUOTE]

I think I have provided enough insightful analysis in my years year here to prove I am much more than a "know nothing."

Kostya is probably one of your favorite fighters, and, as such, you judgment of him is probably clouded with some emotion.

He was talented, and had a very good career. But he never had truly elite, pound four pound talent.

He stood too erect and his defense was average.

He never beat a pound for pound top 10 guy

Let's examine his best wins and where each was at in his career when Kostya beat him :

JC Chavez: Seven years removed from his prime. A shell of what he had been.

Miguel Angel Gonzalez: Had been a very good 135 lb. champion, but was never as effective at 140 lbs. and was coming off a Draw with the aforementioned badly faded JC Chavez.

Rafael Ruelas: A solid 135 lb. champ, but had been destroyed by Oscar De La Hoya in two rounds and after moving up, was decisioned by clubfighter George Scott.

Hurtato: Proved tougher than expected but was knocked unconscious by Pernell Whitaker before facing Tzyu.

Sharmba Mitchell: A good fighter, but protected and carefully matched after being stopped by Steve Johnson and Leavander Johnson earlier in his career.

Zab Judah: This is Kosya's best win. Zab was at or nearing his prime and was on the way up. Zab suquently proved to be a good but never elite. He lost most of his biggest fights.

Roger Mayweather: True, Kostya and not yet reached his peak yet, but had won a world title over a year earlier. Mayweather was at least five years removed from the end of his prime. Regardless, Mayweather was never hurt and landed many right hands. He exposed Tzyu's defensive liabilities. Something, I am sure Vince Phillips noticed when he prepared for Kostya two years later.

Then, there is the comprehensive tko loss to Vince Phillips. Kostya was in his prime when they fought. Phillips was a very solid guy, but never really elite. He used the straight right hand to render Kostya totally helpless. Excuses have been floated for Kostya losing this fight, like being weight drained, or taking Phillips lightly. But, in the final analysis, his limitations were exposed.

Tzyu's managers were very good at matchmaking. In fact, Phillips had lost to Romallis Ellis (albeit controversial decision) in his last fight before facing Kostya. Kostya's managers probably thought Phillips was a good name but past his best. They were wrong.

When I see threads on here where guys say Kostya would beat prime JC Chavez, Meldrick Taylor, and Randall, I shake my head. A few on here even think he could beat prime Pryor. No way.

He would have had problems with prime Mayweather and it is probably a pick em fight. Prime Coggi would have troubled him and been competitive.

Buddy McGirt may have beaten him, as well.

 

Judah wasn't a top 10 P4P?

Stood too erect? Didn't work out too badly for him though, did it?

You've obviously got an agenda against the guy as you've bizarrely criticised his stance! Let's no take this any further. I'm out!

 

Sure Tszyu resume can be debatable, but not his talent, it was clear that he changed his style when he turned pro, he was untouchable in the amateurs.

 

Dont know why Tszyu was never taught to tuck his chin in??

 

At last! Someone who was finally around back then.

Kosta was an outstanding amateur. One of the very best of his time, if not the best.

 

So how does that make him not overrated in judging his pro career?

What does being "untouchable" in the amateurs mean when he was easy to hit as a pro?

All I said in my initial post was that he was overrated.

I provided ample evidence why I believe that to be true.

I don't have any agenda.

I am simply ambivalent about him and feel I can judge his career based on the fact that I really didn't like or dislike him.

I am strictly analyzing the talent and results he showed in the pros.

 

I didn't questioned your opinions about him being overrated, you said that he never had truly elite, pound four pound talent and that isn't truth, being untouchable in the amateurs means that he changed his style in the pros but not that he wasn't an elite talent.

 

Well, i'm 17, but i've seen almost every amateur fight of Tszyu and every other great pro available on the net, and it's clear that Tszyu changed a lot of things, i actually think that he was better as an amateur.

 

You questioned his stance, for christ sake! "Oh I don't rate him because I don't like his stance" LOL! Come one, buddy.

 

He's one of THE greatest 140'ers EVER and he never had elite talent? Come on, buddy.

 

Straight up and easy to hit.

His stance contributed to his defensive liabilities.

More importantly, let's focus on the main issue. That his resume is overrated. The quality of his wins has been overrated because of the names. I thoroughly showed how almost all of these "names" were no longer at their best when he beat them.

Also, I don't care what he accomplished as an amateur or how talented he looked in the amateurs. I am strictly judging his pro career.

"But he changed his style in the pros."

So do a lot of fighters. See Thomas Hearns