Tunney--Fitz only old champ who could beat Louis

Thanks :good

Joe Louis for me would have the most trouble with Langford, after I saw something I liked in one of the small clips the other day (for once!) He certaintly looked 'modern' enough to me. I think Louis would beat him though, but Langford's power seems legit though I'm not sure who he's fighting. He throws a left hook I think and it knocks his opponent across the ring and he falls down against the ropes? The Fireman Flynn one is the one you barely see, this one was scratched but you could see the punch and KD.

Any help?

Thanks for the post though Fogey :good

 

What is interesting is that Tunney singles out Dempsey, Langford and to a lesser extent Fitzsimmons as giving Louis good fights.

He is basicaly implying that those four fighters Louis, Dempsey, Langford, And Fitzsimmons were the best finishers that the heavyweight division had ever seen (possibly in that order).

 

Tunney wrote an article in 1940 (Look magazine I think) where he depicts a Louis-Dempsey fighting ending in 1st round KO for his old rival.
I also believe he wrote an article around 1949 or 1950 declaring Dempsey better than Louis too.
It's a shame the old Gene Tunney site is no longer up, there used to be dozens of articles on there.
His reverence for the old-timers Fitz and Corbett seemed to fluctuate too. I think when he first viewed the films (they didn't become available until later on, late 50s, or 60s perhaps) he was disappointed with the abilities of the older champions. He wrote about that too. I wish I'd saved all those articles when they were up.

 

I think Bob Fitzsimmons deserves to retain the high rating that the old-timer crowd bestowed on him. He's up there with Johnson, Jeffries, Corbett. Before Dempsey, Fitzsimmons was the name most synonymous with "knockout puncher". He was one of the greats.

Somwhere along the line he got forgotten, but gets plenty of respect still from ESB classic and other hardcore historians. There are some detractors of course.

 

Hmmm, the fact here are a bit messy, which is odd for Tunney. Langford was well over 180 pounds at his heaviest.

When Fitz fought Corbett, he was well under 173 pounds.

Perhaps the author took some stuff out of context?.

I was aware Fitz vs Ruhlin ( Rumored to be out there ) and Sharkey was filmed, but I never heard of the Dunkhorst fight being filmed. the intersting point here is many historians, fighters, fans, and managers back in the day had access to fight films that haven't seen the light of day in the modern era.

 

Imteresting insights ,thanks.

 

That wasn't Tunney writing that, it was Mark Nelson from Astoria, Long Island, writing in response to Tunney's claim about Fitzsimmons chances of beating Louis.

The guy says he saw those fights, not that he saw film of those fights.

He gets the weights wrong, I've read reports saying Langford weighing 193 etc. (although I've read in more than one place that Sam's best fighting weight was about 165). And, yes, Fitzsimmons was 167 or less when he fought Corbett, by all accounts.

 

Very interesting read. I'm actually surprised to see Tunney not picking Corbett over Louis, for two reasons:

1. Fighters are usually biased towards other boxers with a style resembling their own... human nature. Ali, despite some of his racist views during the late 60's, always praised Tunney as a great boxer, for obvious reasons.

2. Joe Louis, in 1942, had not acquired the incredible legacy he would eventually retire with, yet. And more importantly: because he was still active, he had not yet gotten that "boost" in greatness that every boxer has, 5-10 years after they retire and when people realise how good they were.



Another interesting thing to note is that Tunney, who certainly is a pugilistic expert,
has an opinion that doesn't seem to be aligned with most historians of that time, who often ranked Louis in the lower part of the top5 or even top10 before and even during the 50's.

 

When did Tunney see Corbett fight ? How?

 

Thank you, sir. This brought me great hilarity in a moment of fatigue.

Just for the record, I would pick Max Schmeling, Jack Sharkey, Primo Carnera, Tony Galento, John Henry Lewis, Max Baer, Billy Conn, Jersey Joe Walcott, Ezzard Charles and Rock Marciano to beat Johnson, but your point was obviously meant for mirth and not serious analysis.

Bravo.