Tunney v Frazier

Wrong. Having hands low, if you know what you are doing, does not mean you are more open for any blow. Dempsey had an all time left hook. Count how many times he lands it vs Tunney. Count how many times Heeney, Gibbons or Dempsey hit Tunney with any blow. Not very often.

 

Joe would stop him ... get serious ..

 

I would bet the best Tunney outboxes Joe. No greater technical boxer ever held the hwt championship a Joe has one immense flaw to exploit.

 

Low hands means you're more open to punches. Full stop. A squared stance as well.

How many boxing trainers have you met that told you to fight like that?

 

Dempsey was past prime ,his legs were gone ,Gibbons
was at the end of the trail having his last fight,and Heeney was a moderate challenger at best, what's his best win?

 

I would bet Tunney outboxes Frazier too,the question is can he do it for the whole of the fight?

 

I dont know. Youd have to ask them and Firpo etc. I just know that the Toledo rules in effect at that time established by the Mayors commission in 1918 state that after a fighter is down his opponent must return to his corner until the opponent is able to rise. The rules implemented in New York in 1920 were even more specific. Its a total myth that Dempsey was unfamiliar with such a rule. That rule was part of the Marquis of Queensberry rules. The vast majority of locales during Dempseys career deferred to or used some modified form of the MoQ rules. Look em up, its specific.

 

I believe I read that the rule was made more specific in that the fighter scoring the kd had to go to the furthest neutral corner.No doubt Dempsey knew the rules.

 

^^^Nails it. Frazier's opponents, in general, did not have the footspeed or stamina to keep moving for 15 rounds as Tunney could.

When they got tired, Frazier grinded on them.

The problem for Frazier is Tunney is not getting tired. He's not going to stay still, allowing Frazier to set his feet and fire that hook. He's not going to rest on the ropes, or get caught in a corner very often

Sure Frazier will land some, but Tunney's chin was excellent, only floored once in 80+ fights.

Like I said Frazier swelled up easy. Tunney's jab would do a number on Frazier, and his right hand was hard enough to drop him.

Essentially Frazier is a one trick pony type. He didn't jab, almost never used an uppercut, and had a mediocre at best right hand. His entire gameplay was to work his way in and keep firing that hook.

 

Again, Frazier was a dominant fighter for SEVEN YEARS of one of the division's greatest eras.

Tunney was a footnote during a transitional stretch between two eras, neither of which was as strong as Frazier's.

You have to come up with better stuff than the imaginary ****I'm reading above.

 

The whole point with Frazier is he didn't need to "set his feet," to hook.

Tunney's stats at heavyweight are meaningless.
he only had a handful of fights at heavyweight, and only the Dempsey fights were against an opponent with pretensions of any power.

Herman ko% 15%
O Dowd ko% 15%
Madden ko% 20%
Heeney ko% 22%
Risko ko% 15%

Tunney met one puncher at heavyweight, a past it Dempsey, and he dropped him for the long count.

 

He also won 19 of 20 rounds, and dropped Dempsey. He whipped Dempsey clean and had the match been 15 rounds likley stops him

Wouldn't you say Dempsey has a better chin than Frazier? I'll ask for an answer.

 

I'm inclined to pick Frazier by a decision,...and I don't think that he'd deck Tunney, one of the smartest fighters ever, who had a great chin to boot.
Peak Frazier would be poison for most all boxers,...and I even pick him over my hero, the wizard Jimmy Young, and even Muhammad Ali at any stage of his career. Peak 1971 Joe Frazier was a force of nature, but is sadly underestimated these days.

 

What Rez posted is in many ways true. Frazier was 85% left hook. The hook was his offense. A great all time boxer which Tunney indeed was can neutralize a one punch offense and Gene would have trained and conditioned himself to do so. It's all about keeping to the left constantly so the hooker needs to constantly reset. Holmes did this although at times awkwardly vs ****ey. Tunneys best punch was the straight right and it's the punch to hit a fighter who is constantly looking to load up with a left hook. Frazier aside from relying too much on his hook was very slow to close the distance. Many times he would stay at mid distance bobbing his head but not propelling himself forward. He would in this posture get slammed especially as his head bobbed up from a crouch. Tunney by 15 round decision in a bout he leads from the very first round.

 

McVey, that same rule also applied to that 15th round of the Ali-Bonavena bout.