Tunney vs Marciano

Tommy Gibbons? Kid Norfolk? Jack Dillon? Brennan was a murderous punching heavyweight and Greb took his punches over the course of four fights. Gene Tunney was also a very formidable puncher at 175. All were skilled and fast, some more so than Moore.

“Greb’s chin wasn’t tested by a puncher like Moore at 175” isn’t the road you want to take in this debate, lol.

 

Klompton would have a stroke if he read this thread

 

My pick is Prime Rocky Marciano over Prime Gene Tunney.

 

Gene's best was his career finale against Tom Heeney. We don't know how much better he might've gotten. Of course he was ringside for numerous Marciano bouts and analyzed Rocky thoroughly.

Tunney's experience was vastly greater by Heeney than what Marciano ever obtained. He'd outmaneuver the slow footed Blockbuster and pepper him with jabs throughout. Unlike JJW, he wouldn't attempt to produce a stoppage. Nor would he gas.

Dempsey inflicted bruises on his thighs. Jack had faster feet and a longer reach than Rocky.

Gene had a nine inch reach advantage, and at least a two inch height advantage while boxing tall.

No, Tunney wouldn't gas. He boxed Carp's ears off for 14 rounds before ending it in the 15th. He won over the Championship Distance against 6'4" Martin Burke and the indefatigable Greb twice, as well as Jeff Smith.

I suspect Rocky's best fight was probably Charles II, where his nose got split by an elbow, but he said afterward that it was actually his easiest fight according to what he told reporters after in the Skehan biography. Prior to the nose getting split open, Marciano's jab was effective, he hooked off it well, and in fact the final knockout punch was a left hook. He didn't look rusty (as he said he felt he was for Charles I), or overtrained (which many speculated was the case of LaStarza II), but sharp for his style of fighting.

Still, not good enough for Tunney's best. Gene's not going to get mauled like Ezz on the inside, he's going to stick and move, stick and move. He started in retreat with Gibbons, then started advancing as the tide turned against Tommy. With Rocky though, he never comes forward, but keeps on going the way he started with Gibbons. That would be sufficient.

Ali stated, "I never said I was the smartest, only the greatest." Gene Tunney probably was the smartest. Marciano was in no way limited in that area, but he had only one way to fight available to him, while Tunney didn't. This'll be a UD for Gene.

 

Perhaps we should get him reinstated then?lol

 

Gibbons was having his last fight.
Carpentier was on the way out.
Smith was a middleweight conceding 13 lbs to Tunney .
Burke was sparring partner quality,and a Light Heavy.
Dillon was a middleweight for his fight with Harry.
Soldier Jones probably hit Greb as hard as anyone ever did.
Can we be sure the Dempsey Tunney fought still had faster feet than Rocky?

 

Bobo Olson, Joey Maxim, Cocoa Kid, Marshall...those are one of the greatest fighters of his era.

 

Not one of those is remotely close to being top 30 ATG. Greb has the strongest argument for being number 1. At very worst, he is number 3, and that requires some mental gymnastics.

 

Greb is p4p tbe, but Marshal was one of the best LHWs and Olson is one of the best fighter of his weight class.

Moore is also bigger man than Greb, and helluva strong with great chin.

 

The Gibbons fight was a title eliminator and Gibbons had won 11 in a row with 10 kos since losing to Dempsey. This including Kid Norfolk who had a win over Harry Greb.

Carpentier was only 30 and his last 3 losses were to Tunney, Gibbons and Loughran. All 3 have wins over Harry Greb.

 

Moore was 64-4 at heavyweight overall, 24-1 vs opponents 200 lbs and above (only Ali beat him) and undefeated at heavyweight the night he faced Marciano.

Moores resume overall was very strong add to it his tremendous punching power something Greb sorely lacked.

Something I came across looking at newspaper archives was “The Greb Problem” written about as if it was something “known”. That problem was Greb was “winning at heavyweight but not in spectacular fashion to gain public interest”.

 

Tunney beat Dempsey who was bigger hit harder and was better than Marciano. Thus Tunney beats Marciano.

 

Tunney beat an older past prime Dempsey. Prime Marciano could be a different story.

Tough fight to call.

 

Moore was a lot bigger than Greb they shouldn't be really treated equally in this regard and while Greb didn't have success at HW most of Tunneys other LHW peers who were somewhat bigger did. Greb was a small point fighter at MW/LHW of course he wasn't going to be a KO threat at HW. Moores power was felt at HW but most of his big wins tended to be decisions or late stoppages. And while his SOS was solid and you've heard of his average opponent theres like 10ish great non Bivins wins at HW. Baker, Henry, Valdesx2, Slade, Sheppardx2, Parker, Rademacher.

Moore won his HW title against 6 ft 3 Valdes and his title eliminator to fight Patterson against 6 ft 4 Parker but generally the best HWs of that era were smaller and that was the smallest era of HW since the 1900s(decade). He wasn't the giant killer. On boxerrec theres a quote by Parker(Moores biggest point) that stands out "Moore never hurt me, although I couldn't see out of the eye from the 4th on."

 

Gibbons had beaten 3 debutees and 5 sausages among that lot he was past it.
"
"This bout, although against a fading and aging former light-heavyweight phenomenon in Tommy Gibbons".

Carpentier too was past his best
Where is the source the Tunney Gibbons fight was a title eliminator?