Tyson Fury . Genuine great fighter or personality driven legacy?

He's a curious enigma to me. Fury had plenty of talent, several good wins, charisma, marketability. Whatever you think of Wilder, their trilogy is up there with the best of them.
Yet for every high there was a low; low risk opponents, pointless fights, a refusal to face Usyk. After a while the goodwill he had earned started to run out - and he either didn't care or didn't recognise it. He's kind of, to me, a guy, who had what he needed to be an ATG but didn't use it properly (in the ring and in terms of his personality, which he let run wild and eventually started to grate). I think he probably didn't fulfil his potential and, therefore, will always remain something of a 'what if'??' character.

 

Loads of folks hate him simply for the fact that he was far more of the real deal than Joshua could ever have been.

There's a legion of Matchroom fanboys who've been indoctrinated to hate Fury. It's sad to see.

 

In regard to AJ it's more about pointing out the inconsistency some fans have. He only gives a rematch when he loses because he has the privilege of being a cash cow. This A-side business isn't good for boxing.

As for Fury/Wlad:

1. I'm saying Wlad didn't deserve it because of his abysmal performance. I say this as a fan not caring about who signed what because I'm not their manager.

2. Yes, Fury left for personal reasons. They're not mutually exclusive. Whether or not Fury retired wouldn't change my opinion that Wlad didn't deserve the rematch.

3. If Wlad had issues he should have either delayed the fight or not done it at all. It's his responsibility as a professional to ensure he is ready to fight or not.

As for boxers pulling out, I didn't specify high profile. Not really sure where you got that from or what relevance it's supposed to have. If you have a fair reason for not fighting I'll respect it, be it personal issues or injury.

I can see we're not gonna change each other's minds here so I'll leave it there. Thank you for the robust discussion

 

Sounds like you're arguing that all avenged rematches (ie: 1-1) should basically automatically go to trilogies?

Which seems a slightly odd position if you're not keen on rematches in the first place, but okay.

I don't necessarily mind that idea - it clogs the division up, but only because fighters don't fight anywhere near often enough anyway.

Ultimately, though, the big difference between AJ getting the rematch against Ruiz and Ruiz not getting it against AJ...
Is that AJ was the established champ, had unified a bunch of belts, and Ruiz had won as a fairly massive underdog (not because he wasn't necessarily any good, as the 50/50 with Parker showed, but just because AJ had looked so dominant and his resume was so much deeper).

And the reason why AJ got it was that it was contracted.

So circling back to the slightly tongue-in-cheek comment at the start of this post - short of contracts starting to mandate trilogies in the event of rematches producing a 1-1 stalemate, how does this happen?

 

lol. If this is the knowledge of a boxing fan, I feel sorry for boxing.

AJ-it’s not inconsistency, it’s commonplace in the industry. Your statement “he only gives out rematches when he loses” doesn’t make sense. The champ agrees the rematch before he loses, for the possibility that he loses. Most do this, including whoever your favourite fighter is. Nothing to do with A sides.
The only inconsistency is having a moan only when AJ or another fighter you don’t like does it.

Below will be more inconsistency from you.

1. ok your personal opinion again, but legally and out of respect for a longstanding champ, and fury’s written word, he did deserve an opportunity to improve on his performance.

2. fury breached his contract for “personal reasons”. You criticise Wlad about professionalism when your defending fury who has possibly the least professional conduct. He pulls out of fights, delays them, breaches contracts fairly regularly. “Personal problems”, try that at work or wherever and breach your contracts as regular as he does and see if “personal problems” excuses it all. INCONSISTENT

3. I agree. I think personal problems should be left personal. Funnily, Wlad did do this, it’s fury who didn’t. And you keep defending fury using his personal issues but dislike others mentioning opponents personal issues INCONSISTENT.

Fighters should fight, pulling out all time is a joke.

please help me and advise all these pullouts from contracted rematches that “happen all time” don’t have to be high profile.

Or are you just talking nonsense and trying to defend your inconsistency ???

 

I don’t know if he knows what he’s arguing for, as it doesn’t really make sense

 

TBF he's almost always a thoughtful poster - just in this instance I'm not exactly sure where he's going...

It's part of the difficulty of even knowing what you want to see these days - fighters activity levels do make for awkward compromises in terms of what we do and don't want to see... Being a bit more rigid on rights to rematch (as I think you and I are) is simpler, but it could make things stale when combined with those activity levels.

 

As you say, it's not the only time Fury's tried to ignore a contracted rematch... Wilder 3 was another example - a less deserved one in my view, but it was in the contract, he knew it was going to be there.

 

I agree. I’m surprised at the points being made by him. Maybe he’s having a bad day.

rights to rematches and fight agreements obviously have to abide by the written agreements. If we can’t abide by these, how can the sport have any official capacity.
If zuffa kicks off, there will be a lot less freedoms and everything will be in contracts.

 

That’s the difference, you can feel it’s not deserved, but respect it is a contractual obligation and that it must be fulfilled.

fury had to be taken to court and lose to get in the ring….its not champion like behaviour we should be supporting or boxing will just be in the court room all the time.

 

I don't think AJ should have gotten the immediate rematch to begin with. My gripe is that he got one and didn't extend the courtesy.

 

@BubblesUK @ruffryders I'd appreciate it if you didn't mock my opinion just because you disagree with it. I feel like I've been pretty respectful and clear, but to clarify:

I am against rematches just because you happened to have held the belts hostage via A-side privileges'. If you lose your champion status, you should be knocked back down the rankings and earn it, giving other fighters a fair shot at the title. Otherwise it's just the same fighter or two getting infinite shots at the title while more deserving challengers miss out.

So yes, I don't think Wlad should have been entitled to the rematch, nor do I think Fury should be forced to take a fight if he's not mentally capable of doing it (for example, battling a drug addiction).

I also don't think AJ should have had a rematch against Ruiz automatically, but because he did I feel that Ruiz should have had an equal opportunity to avenge his loss.

You can make the argument that it's just what boxing is and always has been, and that's fine. I don't think it should be that way though, and I don't think there's anything wrong with pointing that out.

 

Sorry don’t mean to ridicule but it’s because you’re not making sense and making incorrect assumptions to make your point. A surprisingly lack of understanding of what’s happened in the scenario we are discussing and an inconsistent view whilst criticising others for having an inconsistent view for following the protocol

 

In my opinion Fury could have been an ATG but blew it because he was lazy.