Tyson vs. Marciano: The myth of "intagibles"

Conn may have been afflicted with a tinge of the "green-eyed monster." (I didn't say I agreed with him, but merely pointed out his claim. I don't know when Conn said it, or what he said it in reference to, but it would be interesting to find out.)

 

Okay, but as long as a fighter, such as Marciano, is fighting the best out there, I don't see much in this sort of thinking, myself.

 

Of course it's pretty well known that Sam Silverman was setting up Rocky early in his career as a sacrificial lamb for other prospects, and Marciano didn't simply rock the boat by continually turning the tables, he capsized it.

As anybody who read Skehan's Marciano biography knows, Cesar Brion was the heavyweight stablemate of Rocky's originally being groomed for bigger and better things. However, Brion could not get by a comebacking Joe Louis in two attempts, as Marciano surpassed him. (At least one of the Louis/Brion matches was televised, and is occasionally rebroadcast. While the Bomber looks good, the commentator does mention that ringside experts observe Louis to be throwing once punch at a time, instead of his former combinations. Brion did go on to have a respectable career though.)

 

:good :good :good great post

 

:good

 

Well i think that statement was pretty accurate for the time, when talking about contenders or "normal" champions.

As you pointed out, there was only one champion who was undefeated when winning the title. So when talking about an upcoming contender i heard there was the saying "if he's never lost then he never fought anyone". Although there are some exceptions, it is a very good rule of thumb.

 

First of all, by the time Tyson was 15 he was already 210 pounds of solid muscle. He didn't blow up very quickly. And he wasn't under 200 in the amateurs. Tyson in the 1950s would weigh the same as he did in the late 80s, expect maybe he would be maybe 3 or 4 pounds lighter because of the 15 round limit. He didn't take any supplements or steroids, and to my knowledge he didn't even lift weights until he came out of priso. He was just naturally built like a tank.

You don't know what you're talking about.

 

Goldman in interview to New York Post before Marciano's fight with Archie Moore: "he hasn't hit his peak yet. He'll be better a year from now."
"Rocky's improved one-hundred percent over last year."

 

Rocky Marciano is the exception that proves the rule.

 

From a standpoint of technique he may have been right.

I suspect that physicaly it would have been downhill from there however.

 

Goldman was Rocky's trainer. But like Dundee with Ali(Who didnt see the signs,He even said he was blind of Ali in the mid 70's) I feel Goldman may have been the same.

Did he miss the Rock's reduce in speed?? Or the Rock tiring out vs the likes of Cockell??

 

For a heavyweight slugger the handspeed and the age of 32-33 are not that important.

 

But his stimia is for that style the Rock use. He didnt look as fresh vs Cockell as he was vs Charles 1. He also a look a bit winded vs Moore.

 

It could be argued that the Moore fight was as good as we ever saw from Marciano. His workrate was as good as it ever got.

 

A guy on the street even if he exercises regularly will be significantly heavier than his ring weight.

I go to the gym 5 days a week. I am 5' 6'' and a solid 154 lbs but I imagine that if I boxed profesionaly I would end up a welterweight or junior welterweight.

Marciano when he was champion walked the streets at well over 200 lbs.