Tysons Career Without The Prison Sentence

Agree totally that Ruddock wasn't intimidated, and Tyson pasted him, but never really felt he dominated him, certainly in the second fight. To an extent in the first fight, but even then not in the "f**k me, get him out of there, Tyson 's going to kill him" sense that I had before.

 

I think that Tyson gets him out of there quick, both times. No way it goes to the cards. That Tyson was an utter force of nature, probably the most terrifying boxer I've ever seen.

I don't want to seem like I'm ignoring or disrespecting Ruddock, who was a good heavyweight at just slightly below top class, but that Tyson obliterates pretty much any non ATG heavyweight, and probably some of them too.

 

Tyson had Ruddock out on his feet in the second round of the rematch. There was plenty of time left to get the job done. He just couldn't land enough, wading in with one shot at a time.

 

IMO Tyson would always lose to Holyfield. Tyson is real good at at taking single shots but he falls to pieces and freezes when he's hit by combinations. Holyfield of 91 would box him, back him up and drill him with combinations, I think he'd stop him eventually.

 

In the words of himself.."my career was over after Buster Douglas"...
Prison or none..he became what he was..a small heavyweight who didnt have a plan B once he was backed up and his aura of intimidation and invincibility had gone.
He still had something left,the Ruddock fights showed that,but the decline was real and irreversible.

 

I agree to an extent about Holyfield's combinations posing a problem but I struggle to see 91 Holy stopping him. I'm not convinced he had the power. At a stretch maybe a late TKO after Tyson is exhausted. I sway with this match up like hell but in sharing my current thoughts on it I cant help giving Holyfield the edge in many ways, I think he had that toughness Tyson didn't have, mainly because Mike didn't need it, his KO success was his undoing.

Evander was used to going through hell and refused to say no, When Tyson went through hell with Douglas he conceded. Its that mental edge. Tyson even says in his book, he aspired to be one of those greats that you would have to kill to beat, he even said he didn't think he was one of them.

The difference between Holyfield and Tyson losing is that with Mike you saw him shut down, he showed courage but ran out of fight. With Holyfield you saw what you would have to do to beat this guy, basically go to the depths of hell cause he wasnt going away, you had him hurt he would try to kill you. Tyson folded mentally. In loss Holyfield gained a hell of a lot of respect, Tyson lost his invincibility and had people thinking he would;d fold if you just kept to a game plan.

So that does make me feel the only thing stopping Holyfield getting that win in 91 is the physical advantage Tyson had. And as mentioned before, that 91 fight would have shaped Tyson's direction after prison. I agree with what someone else said, he didnt handle loss well so if that happened against Holy I think that would have been it.

 

I think Holyfield hit plenty hard enough in 91 to stop Tyson, don't forget he threw a lot more leather those days compared to 96.

I don't agree with you that Tyson conceded against Douglas, he was beaten all night and showed plenty of heart in that fight, that bout took more out of him than people think IMO.

You're right even though Tyson showed heart in fights, once he started getting hurt in fights and backed up he had no plan B at all and sort of accepted the inevitable.

 

I guess that's kind of what I meant about Tyson, if he is being beaten its all down hill. whereas a guy like Hoyfield refuses to accept it. Tyson was obviously ill prepared but you just cant ignore the mental side of things. He lost the way he did because he simply didn't have that pit bull spirit when he was on the down side of a fight. As you say, when plan A is done that's it. There is a reason why Ali was never knocked out like that and Tyson was, Ali just wouldn't have allowed it, yeah he would lose but not go out like that in a fight.

These days I see Tyson as guy guy that never needed that kind of heart at his best as his physical gifts and talent was so great he could beat nearly every fighter that existed. He would only have trouble with those fighters that had the physical ability to survive and that refusal to lose. There were only a handful of those guys and I think Holyfield could well be one.

Problem is that when Tyson wasn't at absolute his peak he was vulnerable, if one of those ingredients was missing he just became a decent short heavyweight, not a great one. That's why I don't believe he would have done that great if he kept out of prison. He wasn't going to get better and return to his peak, it was going to be a decline.