Uncanny parallels between Gerry Cooney and Deontay Wilder

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by Redbeard7, Dec 25, 2023.


  1. Redbeard7

    Redbeard7 Boxing Addict Full Member

    3,277
    2,325
    Oct 9, 2022
    1. Both were tall and long, regarded as devastating one-handed punchers

    2. Both were heavily hyped after impressive KO streaks and were associated with the hopes of white/black America

    3. Both suffered mentally crushing KO/TKO defeats at the hands of technically superior lineal champions

    4. Both responded with drug abuse (alcohol and cocaine for Cooney, ayahuasca for Wilder) and long periods of inactivity

    5. Both made comebacks but were massively diminished fighters, dominated by technically superior but much smaller, lighter punching underdogs and then brutally KO'd by big punching behemoths
     
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2024
  2. Ioakeim Tzortzakis

    Ioakeim Tzortzakis Well-Known Member Full Member

    1,774
    6,097
    Aug 27, 2020
  3. Redbeard7

    Redbeard7 Boxing Addict Full Member

    3,277
    2,325
    Oct 9, 2022
    Accomplishment is something that separates them. Wilder will get in the HoF, whereas Cooney finished below Chisora on this guy's 2022 list (largely based on Chisora's quality of opposition).

    Wilder HoF

    1. 10 consecutive heavyweight title defences (2nd longest single reign since 1985 behind Wlad), best win being top 5 ranked, 30-0, 93% stoppage ratio Ortiz

    2. KO record (highest KO % among heavyweight champions, lots of spectacular KO's, perhaps the most devastating right hand puncher ever)

    3. Historic trilogy with lineal champion Fury (if Fury beats Usyk for the undisputed championship and retires unbeaten then Wilder's case is strengthened)

    4. Most significant American heavyweight this century thus far (if Anderson and Torrez have less success then Wilder's case is strengthened), broke the 7.5 year American heavyweight title drought
     
  4. Mickc

    Mickc Well-Known Member Full Member

    2,460
    2,620
    Nov 28, 2015
    Wilder was a World champion with 10 defences,Cooney never was a World champion but with three losses to an unbeaten Holmes Spinks and the other loss to Foreman,so three losses to ATG fighters with Cooney having the better resume just not a belt .
     
    ShovelHook and KINGWILDER like this.
  5. deyell

    deyell MOLECULE FROM HELL. Full Member

    6,408
    5,543
    Aug 10, 2015
    Ayahuasca is not addictive like alcohol and opioids, it is also not that "fun" like MDMA and meth that cause euphoria. Also you need a shaman to make ayahuasca brew, it is not possible that a moron like Wilder can do it at home. He probably just tried that once, when he went to an ayahuasca ceremony. Looks like it has not helped him, might have even worsened his mental state.
     
  6. Ioakeim Tzortzakis

    Ioakeim Tzortzakis Well-Known Member Full Member

    1,774
    6,097
    Aug 27, 2020
    I know the Boxing Librarian, and he just focuces on stats. While he does a fantastic job with them, trying to be impartial to eras and counting every possible statistic possible for every fighter, that method of ranking ignores context. And you're left with outright horrible takes like Sam Langford being as great at Heavyweight as Muhammad Ali and Joe Louis, or Maxie Rosenbloom and Johnny Dundee being two of the top 10 greatest fighters ever. But if you hold him in such high esteem, take a look at how he rates Wilder.
    This content is protected


    As far as Wilder goes, his 10 defences consist of only 2 wins over top 10 ranked fighters, and Ortiz is hardly the stuff of legends. Having 8 out of 10 defences being against unranked men is not HoF worthy. His KO rate is nice, but it doesn't mean he is a great fighter, just a great puncher, and they weren't against elite competition. Having a great trilogy doesn't mean he was a great fighter, but given how the unworthy Gatti got in the HoF due to his trilogy with Ward, Wilder will probably get in for it, but he in no way deserves it. And being significant doesn't mean you're a great fighter inside the ring, just a popular one.
     
    ShovelHook and KINGWILDER like this.
  7. The Long Count

    The Long Count Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

    15,428
    8,874
    Oct 8, 2013
    Gatti also likely received a boost from his untimely death getting In posthumously. He is the rare case. Wilder has no shot. The hall should not lower their standards for Wilder for the glamour division.
     
  8. vast

    vast Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

    25,988
    19,883
    Nov 27, 2010
    Having a belt these days is meaningless really.
     
  9. Mickc

    Mickc Well-Known Member Full Member

    2,460
    2,620
    Nov 28, 2015
    Sometimes I wonder that myself,without the sanctioning bodies that means less politics,less interference,basically less BS and it’d be easier to make the fights we all want to see imo. It would still need an unbiased ranking system but would certainly be better than multiple sanctioning bodies all having there input .
     
  10. UnleashtheFURY

    UnleashtheFURY D'oh! Full Member

    73,132
    39,611
    Sep 29, 2012
    Cooneys game losing effort in a 15 rounder again Holmes is more impressive than anything in Wilders career. Doesn't matter if Wilder achieved more. Cooney would have smoked Wilders resume and probably more impressively in most instances.
     
  11. Boxing2019

    Boxing2019 If you want peace, prepare war. banned Full Member

    7,175
    5,448
    Jul 22, 2019
    Both have a poor defence.
     
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2023
    Keleneki likes this.
  12. Redbeard7

    Redbeard7 Boxing Addict Full Member

    3,277
    2,325
    Oct 9, 2022
    Cooney was mentally destroyed after one loss (it took Wilder two) and the best guys he beat were on terrible runs of form. Wilder would have achieved more against Cooney's list than Cooney would against his. Cooney's management were so worried about his lack of discipline that they didn't risk giving him proper experience before the Holmes fight.
     
  13. Redbeard7

    Redbeard7 Boxing Addict Full Member

    3,277
    2,325
    Oct 9, 2022
    Wilder will probably get in, regardless of the whining.

    Wilder HoF

    1. 10 consecutive heavyweight title defences (2nd longest single reign since 1985 behind Wlad), best win being top 5 ranked, 30-0, 93% stoppage ratio Ortiz

    2. KO record (highest KO % among heavyweight champions, lots of spectacular KO's, perhaps the most devastating right hand puncher ever)

    3. Historic trilogy with lineal champion Fury (if Fury beats Usyk for the undisputed championship and retires unbeaten then Wilder's case is strengthened)

    4. Most significant American heavyweight this century thus far (if Anderson and Torrez have less success then Wilder's case is strengthened), ended the 7.5 year American heavyweight title drought
     
  14. miniq

    miniq AJ IS A BODYBUILDING BUM Full Member

    47,846
    27,797
    Oct 23, 2011
    at the hands of technically superior lineal champions (Holmes and Fury)

    Isn't this the most beautiful statement?
     
  15. Mitch87

    Mitch87 Boxing Addict Full Member

    5,561
    5,458
    Jul 29, 2018
    Wilder is the most protected and overrated HW champion of all time, got exposed and beaten by the only 2 proven legit world level boxers in Fury and Parker.

    It's disgusting when he think:
    - Fought a low level Jason Gavern tot earn title shot.
    - Beat one of poorest HW champions in Stiverne.

    - Beat a bunch low level hand picked guys such as Spzilka, Malik Scott, Molina, Stiverne again, Dauhaupas, Ortiz, Brezeale and Helenius.

    - Avoided the top HWS such as Wlad, AJ, Povetkin, Whyte and Parker for years.
     
    KINGWILDER and kriszhao like this.